DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread (P. 17)

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pageC4
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lets hope so. the front office has brought in the best available coach, so if Doc can't make DJ a top center then we know DJ has just reached his ceiling

Grillinnap
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If, and I mean IF, DJ shows massive improvements this season, would you sign him to an extension either during the second half of this season or in the next offseason? He only has 2 years left on his contract including this year.

CP3Heliflopter
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Define massive improvements? What is his FT%? How does he do in the playoffs?

ClipSince7thGrade
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I think that Doc Rivers is going to turn DJ into a beast on defense, there is no doubt in my mind about that and I think he's going to be a big part of our playoffs run, hopefully to the finals. The one and only thing that I'm worried about with DJ is his post game, the only reason why I'm not worried about FT% is because I know Doc is going to be on his ass about it.

Johndoe
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I'm just saying. Deandre should just continue to focus on rebounding and his free throws. But we can say all we want about how we liked how DJ did that, but no other fans see it that way other than us, and that's the reality. I was reading the comments by going to the youtube. DJ gets no respect and is just mocked by what he did. I don't have 95 posts so I can't post it yet. I just wish he wouldn't embarrass himself. The free throws were embarrassing enough. He has had 3 good games, but needs to continue to do that before showing out.

namzug
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I know we are liking what we are seeing right now from DJ, so here's some more on him.

His free throws looked better the last two games, he definitely looks better than 39%

jarca
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Damn VDN wasted the first 2 years of DJ contract by not utilizing him properly

Voyeur
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I'm a Blake fan, but I actually hope to see DJ end the season grabbing more rebounds than Blake. Don't get me wrong, I want Blake to continue to be a double figure rebounder, but as our defensive anchor, it's definitely time for DJ to be our best rebounder. Looking good so far.

ArmoClipFan
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Deandre's been great. He just has to consistently average 11+ rebounds 2 blocks play great D and just make some free throws please, and dunk on foo's

Renegade_Clipper
Clipper Rookie
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,Seasons early but DeAndre has really looked like a leader out there. Its good to see him talking on defense. The foul trouble last night was troubling but that might just be from the absurd pace we were playing

StrikeBack
Clipper Rookie
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DJ's playing better but he's lucky D12 got into foul trouble. The few times D12 went at him, he had no answers.

tense2
CTB MVP X2
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He's pretty done that his whole career...if he gets the minutes (see PER 36).

http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... ade01.html

Icecoldclipper
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Just keep at pace with hitting free throws as of late.

clipperAndrew
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Not really a fair comparison since any player D12 goes at, they have no answers for him.

namzug
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I thought DJ did a fair job against Dwight when going one on one, just would like to see him make sure his opponent doesn't get good position on him. So close to the basket, I don't think there is anyone that is going to stop Dwight or most starting centers from getting baskets. He seems to be watching the whole floor when his opponents sneak in there getting position asking for the ball.

toohipcliptoslip
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It's hard to appreciate how much he does now unless you are close. He's boxing out. He does miniblocks altering shots with his fingertips that you don't see on TV. He alters shots. Players will get embarrassed to the point that they won't call their mamas if they challenge him. D12 did not have his way with DJ .Marc Jackson who will need to hire a Grief Counselor after each of our games has an expression. "Man sized rebound" DJ took some boards from Howard. There was one play where he ripped the ball away from two guys. There were times where they got second chance points but often the reason the first shot didn't go down was DJ. Don't let his stats fool you. He also does more than dunk. He's confident handling the ball

Can anyone say "Vinnie screwed the pooch" on that one? DJ is earning his $$$ and I was one of his haters. He will only get better because what he's doing is fundamentally sound. It will be interesting to see what he does with the likes of Hibbert and Jefferson and Bynum. He had problems with Pau shooting over him but DJ needs to learn to be REAL physical with him.

Big Six for MVP.

Clippersfan86
CTB MVP Champion
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DJ doing great. Vs his two elite opponents in Howard and Cousins he didn't dominate but he played very well. Which is all we need DJ to do! Hold elite big men below their averages and alter shots.. and dominate the weak ones. Exactly what he's been doing. He's been so consistent, which he never was before.

ClipperDB
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I should chime in because I was one of the haters. DJ, you are doing a great job. Keep up the good work...

pageC4
CTB MVP X1
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That's just the nature of the NBA though. Because he's a Clipper his improvement has gone unnoticed. look at Blake Griffin, who has added a decent shot to his game, the sports gurus continue to think all he does is dunk.

clipper*joe
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What way is the proper way? We as a team are worse on defense with Doc. What I see is a guy who actually realized "ish" got real with the near miss of him wearing a Celtics uniform. The situation made him realize he either shits on pot or he gets thrown out with his pants below his knees.

Now, for the fear of "jinxing" this new found passion DJ's found, I'm gonna wait a while longer before I nitpick or praise him.

I praised him early last season by starting a "eat crow" thread about how he's "changed", and in the end, he ended up worse.

"Fool me once...

pageC4
CTB MVP X1
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Agreed, I was also very critical of him, but I see vast improvements. Keep up the good work DJ

jarca
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He's the same player he was than last year. The only difference is he gets the vote of confidence from the coach. As tense mentioned Dj has been averaging double digit rebound per 36 but VDN was more concern of using the stretch four in Odom than develop DJ

CP3Heliflopter
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I wouldn't say he is the same player. Its too early to tell and to be fair Odom was really really good on the defensive end last season he was just offensively inept.

clipper*joe
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I somewhat agree but I think it was Doc putting him in his place ( defense-don't worry about the rest) and gave him the vote of confidence that that is where he will thrive. Last season, he thought he deserved more and he pouted about it. Only difference now is that DJ had no choice but to come to terms with settling on becoming great at one thing.

When the trade fall through, DJ quickly changed his tune and said he would win DPOY with the help of Doc. In other words, he let Doc know he knows his place on this team.

Clipswhit
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Honestly couldn't care less how many blocks DJ is averaging. He's altering shots, forcing missed lay ups with his presence. I find those just as important as blocked shots.

jtwinnaz
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yea. last night i noticed the rockets miss a handful dunks and easy layups because DJ was in the paint. hopefully he continues his efforts every game and into the playoffs when teams want to attack the paint even more.

tense2
CTB MVP X2
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A better coach/teacher can help most people improve their skills. Doc has helped with that so far in building DJ's confidence up instead putting holes in it.

Most everybody does better when you have confidence in them and the skills are already there. So far so good in DJ's case and I have faith it will continue.

Now Mullins on the other hand...

pageC4
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I don't know if maybe it was selective viewing, but Mullens seemed to give Dwight some problems as well.

CP3Heliflopter
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Didn't really see that but I did see plenty of players blow pass him for a layup.

jarca
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Doc has certainly helped his game when it comes to setting picks. Those picks are reminisce of a Malone pick where people would just fly off of him. It was more evident against Houston.

toohipcliptoslip
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Yep Mullens did. IS D12 not the same after his surgery?

CP3Heliflopter
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Dwight Howard isn't a big you dump the ball to and watch him score. His post game still looks like crap and is highly mediocre. It is worse than when he was on the Magic. Not sure if the Rockets are utilizing him correctly offensively.

Agent0
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jarca wrote:
He's the same player he was than last year. The only difference is he gets the vote of confidence from the coach. As tense mentioned Dj has been averaging double digit rebound per 36 but VDN was more concern of using the stretch four in Odom than develop DJ
Odom was good on defense, but it is funny that Odom was not stretching the floor for anyone last season if that was the intent in using him lol

Quote:

Dwight Howard isn't a big you dump the ball to and watch him score. His post game still looks like crap and is highly mediocre. It is worse than when he was on the Magic. Not sure if the Rockets are utilizing him correctly offensively.

Dwight's post game will never look pretty, but the main reasons I won't just want to run a dump him the ball offense is that he is turnover prone and isn't a good passer/playmaker out of the post.

This was the result of the Hawks not doubling him at all in the playoffs though:

27 PPG (22.6 pts/36), 63% FG, 0.4 APG, 4.6 TPG, 113 Ortg (43 MPG)

EDIT: Don't know why I said fouls a lot, I meant that he isn't a good passer

CP3Heliflopter
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^His post game atm doesn't look nearly as good as it was in the past. Somehow he has regressed maybe it was due to back injury and his role on the Lakers. Honestly it is disgusting that the top C in the league still has such a rudimentary offensive game and yea he isn't a good passer in the post like you said.

Agent0
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Yea, I think the injury might have affected him more than we think because he was really improving as a post player and while he never looked super pretty, he had a go to move and counters and could score if single covered.

Now, don't get me wrong, your offense can be based off him sucking in defenders and then the open shots it creates off hockey passes or just defenders sagging, but he can't be a Duncan or KG where he's also the main facilitator. If I have a high level player at another position who can create and score, I can run an offense that features Dwight in the post but isn't primarily based on him posting up.

EG#23
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Good thing the DPOY ballot is written in pencil at the beginning of the year. He just got murdered today but in his defense he has one the worst post defensive players in Griffin to his side.

Voyeur
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The rebounds are great. But if I don't start seeing more blocks or intimidation at the basket and less of other centers getting great position down low against DJ, my enthusiasm and optimism for DJ will deflate pretty quickly.

toohipcliptoslip
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He was playing against a guy who in a year may be the best center in the league. This guy will be hard for anybody to stop. DJ got how many boards? Watch carefully. DJ alters or intimidates a lot of shots. A lot of things that look like misses are things he hits with his fingers. I couldn't stand the guy 2 mos ago. MVP (or at least Kinda Valuable Player)

Wait. By march DJ will have a signature offensive move and will be a beast.

Voyeur
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Better be right. Because a "beast" is what Vucevic was last night.

CP3Heliflopter
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I agree but to be fair Vucevic is quite beastly(man I really wanted him in fantasy). If DJ only had to worry about Vucevic he would have done better. He also had to cover for our guards and wings when they let players blow past him. I am not saying he isn't at fault in anyway its just that it was more of a team issue than it was DJ's fault alone.

DJ has actually been fairly good defensively this season. I can't fault him at all for our defensive woes. Its just that everyone else has been pretty much complete crap defensively. Even an elite defensive anchor like Dwight last season couldn't compensate for the poor defense of Kobe and Nash.

Overall, I am fairly happy with his production. He has been playing A LOT more minutes than last season and he arguably has better production per minute than last season.

tense2
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Yes, DJ didn't have "Great" game, but if this is one of his "bad" games, I'll take all year long, lol....especially against a monster young center.

Cliptonyte
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It's the NBA and night after night, guys go up against other professional players, who are the best in the world. You can defend someone perfectly and they are still going to score, especially when someone gets hot. CP3 is all defensive team, yet guys still go off on him at times.

StrikeBack
Clipper Rookie
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Why do people want to be fair to poor dj? Being fair won't win championships. Fixing glaring weaknesses will. In a world where everyone gets a medal for participation then yes be fair to dj. Blake isn't a good defended so we need a really strong post defender. Screw this fair business.

comeONcraig
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it's funny how expectations have drastically changed in a matter of a couple of months for DJ. many were asking for him to atleast average 10 pts. and 12 rebounds. he is doing just that and some. he's doing more than just stat sheet material. DJ has become more vocal, applying a new intensity and mindset. sure, DJ does have some defensive lapses, but habits are hard to break. now it seems like many are seeking for DJ to highly dominant and shut everyone down. in my opinion, he's doing just fine and some. just because Doc Rivers has become our coach and sparked DJ's passion for the game doesn't mean DJ will become a defensive juggernaut overnight. 5 games in, better to get these habits and tendencies out now than later.

Clippersfan86
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I'm happy with DJ. If his bad games are going to be 7 point, 18 rebound games.. or 9 points, 11 rebound games... hell yea I'll take it. Last year a bad game for DJ was much more destructive. I DO want him to get that shotblocking and FT shooting up... but considering he's been maybe our most stable, less streaky guy on the team we should cut him slack for now.

CP3Heliflopter
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Why shot blocking? Shot blocking isn't necessarily a good indicator of defense. He has met my expectations so far. This is exactly what I expected him to do. What I didn't expect was for our starters and bench to be so bad defensively. Especially our starters(bench isn't that big of a surprise since they have **** bigs). Dudley has really not been up to par on defense. Redick has met my expectations. Defensively limited due to physical tools but at least he tries.

Clippersfan86
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Agree... but even his rim contests can improve/blocks or not. Tyson Chandler only averages like 1.2-1.5 blocks a year and he's a better defensive anchor than say Ibaka. Agree Dudley on D+R has been atrocious. He needs to lose about 15 pounds.

Clippersfan86
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12 points, 18 rebounds, 4 assists, 3 blocks, 2 steals tonight.

On the season..

11.4 ppg, 15.5 rpg, 2.2 bpg, 1.7 steals per game through 7 games.

Sure it's early but he's dominating.

CP3Heliflopter
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I am really glad that we didn't trade him for KG. Doc wasn't joking around when he said he saw great potential in DJ. He is able to bring it out of him unlike VDN.

Clippersfan86
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KG who? I agree 100 percent. I didn't think it would pay off like this NOT to trade DJ. He's been the epitome of consistency this year.

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