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noairfees
Post Subject: RE: DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread Post ID: 419976by noairfees » Dec 10, 2013 - 01:02 AM PST
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DeAndre seems to get better each year. I can't remember any center being as agile as Jordan?



                
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jarca
Post Subject: RE: DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread Post ID: 419996by jarca » Dec 10, 2013 - 10:18 AM PST
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Defensive player of the year is a stretch but who can challenge him for most improve.

                
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FreaKeyy
Post ID: 419999by FreaKeyy » Dec 10, 2013 - 11:22 AM PST
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Paul George

                
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CP3Heliflopter
Post ID: 420004by CP3Heliflopter » Dec 10, 2013 - 11:32 AM PST
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He won that last season already. I don't think anyone has ever won it twice. Funnily enough he actually deserves it a lot more this season than last season considering how much he improved. He is a legit MVP candidate though. Yea no chance he wins it.

                
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CP3Heliflopter
Post ID: 420005by CP3Heliflopter » Dec 10, 2013 - 11:34 AM PST
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This season Drummond. He is like a rich man's DJ tbh but that is not an insult to DJ Drummond has been a force of nature this season.

I am assuming you never saw Hakeem play?

                
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Flushyriver
Post ID: 420007by Flushyriver » Dec 10, 2013 - 11:45 AM PST
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Maybe one of the younger guns? Like Anthony Davis maybe

                
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marten81
Post ID: 420011by marten81 » Dec 10, 2013 - 01:04 PM PST
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eric bledsoe

                
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Agent0
Post ID: 420031by Agent0 » Dec 10, 2013 - 03:55 PM PST
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Flushyriver wrote:
Maybe one of the younger guns? Like Anthony Davis maybe
Paul George Andre Drummond Anthony Davis Eric Bledsoe Evan Turner Spencer Hawes

Missing anyone?

CP3Heliflopter wrote:
This season Drummond. He is like a rich man's DJ tbh but that is not an insult to DJ Drummond has been a force of nature this season.

I am assuming you never saw Hakeem play?

Probably have to add David Robinson too, guy was an athletic beast himself, and Alonzo Mourning was quite mobile.

                
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Agent0
Post ID: 420032by Agent0 » Dec 10, 2013 - 04:05 PM PST
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I'm really loving the additions to NBA.com, though I feel like they'll start making people pay a membership for some of this stuff.

They chart contested rebounds:

    Rebounding Opportunities: The number of times player was within the vicinity (3.5 ft) of a rebound. Measures the number of rebounds a player recovers compared to the number of rebounding chances available as well as whether or not the rebound was contested by an opponent or deferred to a teammate.

Andre Drummong leads the league in contested rebounds per game: http://stats.nba.com/playerTrackingRebounding.html?pageNo=1&rowsPerPag e=25&sortField=REB_CONTESTED&sortOrder=DES

Here is the contested rebound percentage of players in the league: http://stats.nba.com/playerTrackingRebounding.html?pageNo=1&rowsPerPag e=25&sortField=REB_UNCONTESTED_PCT&sortOrder=DES&filters=REB*GE*5

I filtered for players averaging 5 RPG or more so that guys who played like one game and got one rebound aren't listed. Dwight Howard leads the league in uncontested rebounds.

Uncontested rebounds = rebounds where no opponent is within 3.5 feet

Really a good list of statistics to look at in order to get a more full picture about rebounding prowess. A breakdown between offensive and defensive would be nice though.

                
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toohipcliptoslip
Post Subject: RE: DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread Post ID: 421627by toohipcliptoslip » Dec 17, 2013 - 01:57 AM PST
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I mentioned this in another thread but DJ was practicing corner bank shots a la Duncan. He hit 2/4 or more and it wasn't flukey. Bowen was a great corner three shooter but his FT's sucked but not as bad as DJ's. This may be getting interesting.

                
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Silasie
Post ID: 421642by Silasie » Dec 17, 2013 - 05:44 AM PST
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He's got a decent hook too. Maybe this season we get defensive anchor DJ. And next we get DJ-does-it-at-both-ends DJ. You can but hope. It would be amazing to have a genuine certified Big 3.

                
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Voyeur
Post Subject: RE: DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread Post ID: 421660by Voyeur » Dec 17, 2013 - 09:49 AM PST
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I'm a harsh critic of DJ, but I really liked his play against San Antonio! Great job, DJ! Even though the refs tried to take you out of it.

                
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jarca
Post ID: 421674by jarca » Dec 17, 2013 - 11:16 AM PST
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So it's ok to be a harsh critic of DJ but not of Redick?

                
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Agent0
Post ID: 421677by Agent0 » Dec 17, 2013 - 11:22 AM PST
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DJ's hook shot is actually really good and he can do it with both hands. His issue in the post is more turnovers and vision and that if he gets fouled it is ineffective offense.

                
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Voyeur
Post ID: 421678by Voyeur » Dec 17, 2013 - 11:24 AM PST
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All "fair" criticism is okay. My complaints about DJ have been when he allows someone to torch him who shouldn't be. Or when he misses his free throws. Y'know, specific examples. I describe it as "harsh" because sometimes I feel I'm piling on. At least I can recognize that.

                
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ClipperDB
Post Subject: RE: DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread Post ID: 421680by ClipperDB » Dec 17, 2013 - 11:39 AM PST
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I believe DJ has improved a great deal this season but his foul shooting is killing us. My recommendation for DJ is to shoot foul shots UNDERHANDED. Rick Barry will show him how to do it and guarantees DJ will shoot approx. 80%

                
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CP3Heliflopter
Post ID: 421682by CP3Heliflopter » Dec 17, 2013 - 11:42 AM PST
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I wish someone actually did this but players just hate to look like "pussies" for doing it. Kind of stupid imo but true.

                
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jarca
Post ID: 421686by jarca » Dec 17, 2013 - 12:08 PM PST
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So. My criticism of Redick that he can't alter shot, unable to play ISO defense or can't create his own shot and for others not specific. I've always said he plays high school college defense where he'll get into the right spot but can challenge the offensive player's shot. I guess those aren't specific. But I know how this board goes.its ok to constantly criticize DJ. He's a punching bag but God forbid we criticize other players

                
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Voyeur
Post ID: 421687by Voyeur » Dec 17, 2013 - 12:17 PM PST
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Those criticisms might be fair if they were true. Truth is, he CAN do those things, sometimes he gets burned. That's it. YOU use it as an excuse to dislike Redick. There's no doubt in my mind. Why else would you be all for Crawford continuing to start? You don't think there are just as many specific problems with Crawford's defense? Anybody with eyes can tell you the starting backcourt's defense is better with Redick than it is with Willie or Jamal. Now if you want to continue this conversation, I suggest you do so in the Redick thread.

                
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Voyeur
Post Subject: RE: DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread Post ID: 421688by Voyeur » Dec 17, 2013 - 12:23 PM PST
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One more thing. All my criticisms of DJ are because I like him and WANT him to be better. I doubt that's the motivation of certain people on this forum.

                
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CP3Heliflopter
Post ID: 421689by CP3Heliflopter » Dec 17, 2013 - 12:28 PM PST
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So what about Crawford who is much worse defensively than Redick? Redick can't create his own shot but is that really a bad thing? Not many role players can create their own shot. Guys who can do well off the ball have value too, sometimes more value than guys that need the ball to be effective. Besides how will CP3 "hog" the ball if guys like Redick are trying to create their own shot? Wink

As long as Redick is there to try to contest the shot and knows when to rotate on D I am fine with that. He isn't supposed to be a lockdown defender that is not his role.

                
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jarca
Post ID: 421690by jarca » Dec 17, 2013 - 12:34 PM PST
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Because CP gets another handler on. Jcross instead of CP holding on to the ball for 18 seconds waiting for people to get open. It results to a faster pace offense. That's why I want Jcross to start but you're mind reader so tell me what i am thinking now

                
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jarca
Post ID: 421692by jarca » Dec 17, 2013 - 12:36 PM PST
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He's fast enough not to get lost on screens. Crawford is a gambler on defense that's his downfall. But he would stay focus on chasing the ball and staying in front of his guy he's alright not great but ok. Kinda like when he chased Paul George through double screen and bothered him enough to miss his pull up jumper

                
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jarca
Post ID: 421694by jarca » Dec 17, 2013 - 12:38 PM PST
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That's what a lot of people say but that doesn't mean it's true. The criticism went so far last year that forum members started stalking him on twitter. Not saying it was you but seems like a cool thing to do in this forum and no one will challenge you.

                
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Voyeur
Post ID: 421703by Voyeur » Dec 17, 2013 - 01:11 PM PST
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That's just it. He wasn't holding onto the ball for long periods of time while Redick started. Faster pace? You WERE around while Redick started, weren't you? The pace was EXACTLY what Doc wanted while he was on the court.

And if you can look back on my comments, I think you can get the idea that I'm only rooting for DJ. I don't understand why you can't root for JJ to continue to help the team.

Case in point: Let's say this off season, I wanted Iggy or somebody else at SF. Iggy is a great defender, rebounder and passer at the SF position. But instead we get Dudley, and maybe I'm disappointed (mind you, this is just a "what if" scenario).

But let's say Jared comes out and immediately plays hard on defense, puts up his best overall numbers of his career so far and actually helps the team win...

...Am I going to sit around and complain that we should have gotten somebody else? Am I going to completely ignore his contributions to the team.

No.

I'm going to root for him to continue to contribute. I'm going to root for him to make this team better.

After all, he's a Clipper now. He's one of our guys!

                
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namzug
Post Subject: RE: DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread Post ID: 421724by namzug » Dec 17, 2013 - 02:49 PM PST
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Yeah so DJ I thought did a good job on Duncan when he was covering him. What did you all think? I know he bit hard on that one play that Duncan had two or three pump fakes, but other than that he did a pretty good job in my opinion. I thought Duncan kind of went off a little when DJ sat down and got his first few points in a hurry while DJ was out.

                
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Voyeur
Post ID: 421728by Voyeur » Dec 17, 2013 - 03:05 PM PST
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Yeah, they're both physically similar. 6'11 with long arms. Seemed like a good match up for DJ defensively. DJ of course younger and more athletic, but Duncan more savvy.

                
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namzug
Post Subject: RE: DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread Post ID: 421810by namzug » Dec 18, 2013 - 11:33 AM PST
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I love that DJ isn't buying on all the pump fakes anymore. I really think he's continuing to grow at a pretty rapid pace. I still think he has room to grow, but the good thing is it looks like he is headed in the right direction.

If he develops a bank shot off that corner he could be really dangerous. I'm not sure who was saying they saw him make a few in the corner during warm ups.

                
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letitbled
Post ID: 421811by letitbled » Dec 18, 2013 - 12:23 PM PST
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Crawford much worse? That's really not true. It's a toss up but I think Crawford has been doing a pretty good job this year. He's creating turnovers and rebounding better than normal.

                
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jarca
Post Subject: RE: DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread Post ID: 422086by jarca » Dec 19, 2013 - 12:20 AM PST
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How would you guys value DJ? Is he still overpaid or underpaid or just right

                
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Clipswhit
Post Subject: RE: DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread Post ID: 422095by Clipswhit » Dec 19, 2013 - 12:34 AM PST
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^ that's a good question. I think at this point, he's just right. He has a huge impact on the game defensively, but I think he'd have to have the ability to take over offensively to get paid more than he does.

                
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Kingkanyon
Post ID: 422096by Kingkanyon » Dec 19, 2013 - 12:37 AM PST
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I love DJ, Always have always will, so naturally I'm very biased towards him, plus I've been watching basketball forever and I've studied it immensely so I know how rare it is to find a 6'11 Athletic Center who is as fast and as big as Deandre Jordan with quickness and who never gets hurt at the same time. So I would never trade Deandre Jordan not even for a Dwight Howard. I can't ever say he was overpaid because I never expected him to earn his contract right away and nor did the Clippers. But I'd say he's making exactly what he should.

I know one thing, if people think he's overpaid than think about this,

he's leading the league in FG percentage, Top 3 in Rebounding (witch he's 2nd) and Blocked Shots witch he's 3rd in. My brother used to ask me when Dwight was on the Lakers if I'd trade Deandre for Dwight Jokingly, and seriously I'd always tell him "Hell No", my reason his that Deandre Jordan is intense he brings his best every night, good or bad, and as a fan that's all I ask.

                
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david
Post ID: 422105by david » Dec 19, 2013 - 02:45 AM PST
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Yes he is biting way less for those fakes now. And what was it the second or third play of the game when he caught it in the lane, made a quick move and just dunked it. That was a "WHOA" moment. His focus, intensity & energy have been noticeably better this season as well.

As far as overpaid or underpaid- I'd say neither- he is earning his worth. Hopefully he improves his FT's then he'd really be something.

                
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TheDude
Post ID: 422121by TheDude » Dec 19, 2013 - 11:10 AM PST
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I literally said WHOA when that happened. The way he's been playing has made me want to start a thread called "Would you pay DJ the max in order to keep him after next year?". Assuming he continues to be consistent with this level of production, more than likely that's what it's gonna take to keep him. He should probably be an all star this year although I don't think he'll get that respect yet.

I think they'll try to give him a 3year extension this summer and hope to avoid that bidding war. If he takes an extension, he'd be expiring the same time as Blake and CP and we can negotiate with all of them at the same time in 2019. By then they'll be lifers and hopefully wearing a few matching rings.

                
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jarca
Post ID: 422122by jarca » Dec 19, 2013 - 11:32 AM PST
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Please no bidding war. We all know how that turned out vs. GS. Would have been great if DJ accepted the 5 yrs for 40 mil. Don't blame him for waiting since he's coming off rookie salary

                
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tense2
Post ID: 422124by tense2 » Dec 19, 2013 - 11:36 AM PST
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What do you think. wink

http://www.spotrac.com/rankings/nba/center/limit-25/

                
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jarca
Post ID: 422125by jarca » Dec 19, 2013 - 11:38 AM PST
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I always argue with CJ and CF86 that DJ is paid just right

                
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tense2
Post ID: 422127by tense2 » Dec 19, 2013 - 11:48 AM PST
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Yep, particularly if you know what the average cost is for a center now days.

                
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CP3Heliflopter
Post ID: 422149by CP3Heliflopter » Dec 19, 2013 - 02:22 PM PST
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I wouldn't do the trade(based on what I have seen this season) simply because of the 8m extra salary since Dwight gets the super max.

                
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toohipcliptoslip
Post ID: 422221by toohipcliptoslip » Dec 19, 2013 - 09:08 PM PST
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DJ is playing near 2nd team all star level. That up and under he did was art. If he hits his corner bank as he was doing in shoot around he +Blake will literally be unstoppable. Blake hit two threes.

Again to quote Mr. Spock after he porked the Romulan captain. "I was moved emotionally"

Thank you Doc Rivers. He and Blake have been a two man wrecking crew

Barkley the only thing that's soft is your pee pee

                
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CP3Heliflopter
Post Subject: RE: DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread Post ID: 422243by CP3Heliflopter » Dec 19, 2013 - 11:51 PM PST
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You guys think DJ could be an All star this season?

                
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Steady818
Post Subject: RE: DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread Post ID: 422245by Steady818 » Dec 19, 2013 - 11:56 PM PST
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DJ is still overpaid.. Nothing to it but players his size with his athletic ability tend to get more money than they are worth..

He needs to knock down a much higher percentage of his free throws and still need to see what he does come playoff time to asses his worth.

                
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jarca
Post ID: 422261by jarca » Dec 20, 2013 - 12:44 AM PST
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Only if we finish 1st in the standing which I doubt. Too many haters on the national media especially TNT

                
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CapsNClips
Post ID: 422262by CapsNClips » Dec 20, 2013 - 12:49 AM PST
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I don't think he'll be an All-star this year because of all the talent in the West, but I think he can be an All-star caliber player.

                
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Clippersfan86
Post ID: 422266by Clippersfan86 » Dec 20, 2013 - 01:38 AM PST
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And until this year when he exploded, you were wrong. Which is why I haven't said a bad thing about DJ once this year. All I EVER asked of him was to play his ass off every night and play defense. Finally he figured it out.

                
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Kingkanyon
Post ID: 422270by Kingkanyon » Dec 20, 2013 - 02:07 AM PST
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Not Really, DJ was Averaging Great numbers for the Amount of time he was on the floor, Joakim Noah in the Same amount of time was averaging around the Same Numbers.

But anyway DJ was never suppose to earn his Contract right away, he was a 2nd Round Pick, and a project player, It was Up to Vinny to give him the Time on the Floor that he really never got. He's getting the Time and he has Improved his game like he promised he would when he signed his Contract. The Scary Part is he might have a shot to outperform his Contract, and Given How Valuable Ben Wallace was a player who DJ is sorta becoming like, He could Garner a Max Contract in the Future.

Man Hard to believe he's only 25----

                
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Silasie
Post ID: 422273by Silasie » Dec 20, 2013 - 06:14 AM PST
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It's not just time on the floor that's helped DJ this season though. It's also Doc's coaching, clever man management and trust he's put in DJ

                
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Kingkanyon
Post ID: 422276by Kingkanyon » Dec 20, 2013 - 07:09 AM PST
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That's True as well, but you to have to have the Talent to play the Part. But I do remember Young Kendrick before Doc and KG got to boston, (Surprisingly He had allot more offensive game before doc), Doc turned him into a great defender and he's doing the same with Deandre. But even Kendrick did not perform at DJ's Level-In Terms of Numbers.

                
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Silasie
Post Subject: RE: DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread Post ID: 422277by Silasie » Dec 20, 2013 - 07:23 AM PST
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^

Your a Big fan of the Capital Letter Wink

                
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Clippersfan86
Post Subject: RE: DeAndre Jordan Performance Discussion Thread Post ID: 422278by Clippersfan86 » Dec 20, 2013 - 08:36 AM PST
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I'm well aware DJ was drafted for the long term but after he became the full time starter and got 11 mill a year thanks to GS, expectations rose tremendously. Although I wouldn't use numbers in his defense. His biggest flaws were always being a mental midget. He vanished in the playoffs bad both years, pouts a lot and gets punked almost every game. At least it used to be that way. Hoping it's gone for good.

                
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