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clippersforlife33
Post ID: 389554by clippersforlife33 » Jun 15, 2013 - 11:37 PM PST
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the fact that clippers even considered trading blake for dwight is mind boggling. sh*t like this is what ruins team chemistry. i can tell blake is upset with the organization right now



                
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ClipSince7thGrade
Post ID: 389555by ClipSince7thGrade » Jun 15, 2013 - 11:43 PM PST
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Second you on that

                
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namzug
Post ID: 389556by namzug » Jun 15, 2013 - 11:47 PM PST
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These rumors suck, can't wait for this to be done with. For the record I would rather keep Blake and lose cp3 than vice versa. Blake has a higher ceiling barely scratching the surface. Every team in the playoffs has a great pointguard. Maybe none are as good as cp but the drop off is not that drastic, with the new crop of pg's looking even better. Blake is in a league of only a few pf in my opinion, with Blake, Kevin love, zbo, and maybe aldridge. On top of that I think he has the most upside of the rest.

Let's not forget who made us eager for the future as a clippers fans. I know it was Blake for me, Paul just accelerated it. I was excited about mo, eg, aminu, Blake and dj and even thought with caron and chauncey we would of been the 8th seed. All I am saying is that Blake made our team relevant. Maybe cp3 made us contenders but are him and dwight Gonna do any better. If this is the alternative to losing Paul, bye bye Paul.

if Paul leaves with all these crap rumors surrounding him I doubt any young players will want to play with him. If he wants to leave so badly or pair up with his friends so much than trade him for Paul George and we are all happy.

                
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FreaKeyy
Post ID: 389558by FreaKeyy » Jun 15, 2013 - 11:54 PM PST
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agreed!

                
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seanrooks
Post ID: 389559by seanrooks » Jun 15, 2013 - 11:59 PM PST
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Clipperfn4lf wrote:
seanrooks wrote:
LeftHook wrote:
A team that has Garnett & Pierce in the starting lineup next season are not Championship contenders. They are both almost 40.
36 and 37, which is pretty old, but it's not 40. Here's the thing: a team led by Pierce and Garnett, just a few months ago, made the playoffs. Sure, it was in the East and they were about a .500 team. But imagine that instead of being the best players on a team decimated by injuries(Rondo played only 38 games) and lacking much of a supporting cast(washed up Jason Terry? Jeff Green?) they would be playing alongside Paul and Griffin. As 3rd and 4th options, on a team with younger stars and at the very least Jamal Crawford on the bench, Pierce and Garnett can take a much lighter load, at least until the playoffs. Even at this age, Garnett and Pierce are probably a huge upgrade over Jordan and Butler. Now, I'm not sure I'd give up what Boston is asking(Jordan, Bledsoe and 2 picks) just for Garnett and Doc. But if those 2 and Pierce find their way here somehow, a lineup of KG-Griffin-Pierce-(Afflalo? Willie?)-Paul with Crawford on the bench would be a damn scary team, even if KG and Pierce aren't the same players they were 5 years ago.

ya but in the West they would not have made it.

....did you read anything else I wrote?

                
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Steady818
Post ID: 389560by Steady818 » Jun 16, 2013 - 12:11 AM PST
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If the price is right do it. You are not giving away the future for guys close to retirement.. IMHO i think you are building towards it. A guy like Garnett to mentor Blake would do wonders, and a real run for a championship would make this teams future a whole lot more brighter.. Let Dwight be don't want the guy.. But KG on this team would be monumental..

                
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ekker3
Post ID: 389561by ekker3 » Jun 16, 2013 - 12:45 AM PST
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which would you prefer: 1. not risking giving away the future and hoping for the best 2. going all in on a legit, honest to goodness roster that would be considered the odds-on favorite to win RIGHT NOW.

in normal circumstances, id probably say #1. but when option #2 is thrown your way, YOU CANT TURN IT DOWN.

                
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ClipsGForce
Post ID: 389563by ClipsGForce » Jun 16, 2013 - 12:47 AM PST
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No no no! I will not even trade Blake Griffin for Dwight Howard. Don't do it!

                
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Supphector17
Post ID: 389564by Supphector17 » Jun 16, 2013 - 12:49 AM PST
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I rather trade cp3 than Blake griffin Griffin has turned this organization into great heights! Why ruin that over a baby cry like Dwight

                
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Purple#Gold
Post ID: 389565by Purple#Gold » Jun 16, 2013 - 12:52 AM PST
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You guys don't have to worry about this happening, the lakers aren't gonna do it lol

                
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Supphector17
Post ID: 389566by Supphector17 » Jun 16, 2013 - 12:53 AM PST
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They better not I be furious!

                
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clipperstown
Post ID: 389568by clipperstown » Jun 16, 2013 - 12:55 AM PST
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the lakers aren't even going to get an option to accept or decline, the clippers would never offer it. it was a BS rumor

                
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Voyeur
Post ID: 389569by Voyeur » Jun 16, 2013 - 12:57 AM PST
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No way the Clippers would be considered favorites with both DJ and DH on their front line. One is a terrible FT shooter with a limited post up game. The other is DJ! Razz

                
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ekker3
Post ID: 389575by ekker3 » Jun 16, 2013 - 01:24 AM PST
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good point, a trade with us wont happen. dwight will just walk out, leaving lakerland with nothing in return.

                
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Purple#Gold
Post ID: 389583by Purple#Gold » Jun 16, 2013 - 02:17 AM PST
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Besides an extra 20 million in cap space for 2014 lol.

                
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ekker3
Post ID: 389587by ekker3 » Jun 16, 2013 - 02:30 AM PST
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Purple#Gold wrote:
Quote:
good point, a trade with us won't happen. dwight will just walk out, leaving lakerland with nothing in return.

Besides an extra 20 million in cap space for 2014 lol.

in all seriousness, if lebron sign with LAL in 2014 (highly unlikely he will), its gonna be rough trying to win with the likes of bargnani, deng or maybe vince carter.

                
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CP3Heliflopter
Post ID: 389588by CP3Heliflopter » Jun 16, 2013 - 02:31 AM PST
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I would lol if Dwight just walked out on the Lakers. My ass they would not take BG and Bledsoe. They would take it and run. Wouldn't be surprised if it was them who spread the rumors. No interest in this trade unless they accept a lowball offer.

                
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LuvMeSumMEE
Post ID: 389589by LuvMeSumMEE » Jun 16, 2013 - 02:36 AM PST
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The rumors only work if the front office is completely ignorant.

                
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LuvMeSumMEE
Post ID: 389590by LuvMeSumMEE » Jun 16, 2013 - 02:37 AM PST
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Purple#Gold wrote:
Quote:
good point, a trade with us won't happen. dwight will just walk out, leaving lakerland with nothing in return.

Besides an extra 20 million in cap space for 2014 lol.

You're still over the cap, even if D-12 and Metta leave...

                
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bullterrierclipsfan1349
Post ID: 389591by bullterrierclipsfan1349 » Jun 16, 2013 - 02:39 AM PST
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enough of trying to cater to cp3. thats why this rumor has been brought up, because cp3 and howard want to play together. f*** that. id rather do this deal to be honest: rondo. pierce, KG and rivers for cp3, DJ, multiple draft picks and butler. then if necessary, we trade ebled for a starting 2. id rather keep griffin.

                
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Supphector17
Post ID: 389594by Supphector17 » Jun 16, 2013 - 02:45 AM PST
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Yea I love how rondo plays! Some people dnt give him the credit he deserves

                
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LuvMeSumMEE
Post ID: 389595by LuvMeSumMEE » Jun 16, 2013 - 02:48 AM PST
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I'd rather take James Harden off of Houston's hands and build around him and Blake, LoL. I think it would be easier to build a team around Harden and Blake than CP3 and Blake.

                
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bullterrierclipsfan1349
Post ID: 389598by bullterrierclipsfan1349 » Jun 16, 2013 - 03:15 AM PST
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^ agreed. too bad the rockets wouldnt do that or who knows.

                
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bullterrierclipsfan1349
Post ID: 389599by bullterrierclipsfan1349 » Jun 16, 2013 - 03:17 AM PST
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Supphector17 wrote:
bullterrierclipsfan1349 wrote:
enough of trying to cater to cp3. thats why this rumor has been brought up, because cp3 and howard want to play together. f*** that. id rather do this deal to be honest: rondo. pierce, KG and rivers for cp3, DJ, multiple draft picks and butler. then if necessary, we trade ebled for a starting 2. id rather keep griffin.

Yea I love how rondo plays! Some people dnt give him the credit he deserves

because he is not a great shooter and is selfish at times, but the point is that hes a top 5 pg and that its annoying to be catering to cp3 for so long.

                
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FightOnRon
Post ID: 389621by FightOnRon » Jun 16, 2013 - 08:58 AM PST
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clipperstown wrote:
Purple#Gold wrote:
You guys don't have to worry about this happening, the lakers aren't gonna do it lol

the lakers aren't even going to get an option to accept or decline, the clippers would never offer it. it was a BS rumor

I love when the crazy **** comes out like this,and then the Laker supposedly wouldn't do this. YOu know they would in a heartbeat if it were true,who wouldn't want to get rid of Brokeback for a very very good Pg and Blake.

We need to start our own rumors and see if we can go national with them.

                
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wessleejr
Post ID: 389652by wessleejr » Jun 16, 2013 - 12:05 PM PST
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ekker3 wrote:
Purple#Gold wrote:
You guys don't have to worry about this happening, the lakers aren't gonna do it lol

good point, a trade with us won't happen. dwight will just walk out, leaving lakerland with nothing in return.

Yep and let Dwight call cP3 and say can we just join forces with blake? Smile

                
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clipper*joe
Post ID: 389681by clipper*joe » Jun 16, 2013 - 12:53 PM PST
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Looks like we have Lakers lurkers here.

They have been trashing Howard all season and now that this rumor came out, they think that Howard will net them Bledsoe, Griffin, and a few 1st rounders. lol

They're laughing at us for thinking BG is our franchise yet they think Howard is their franchise. lol

Brokeback Coward! The lakers have so much problems and everything hinges on this fool to sign a max contract with them or bust. All they have to look forward to is to keep a player that will probably leave or get that oh so elusive cap room and go all in on Lebron or restricted FA's!

These guys are so comical

http://forums.lakersground.net/viewtopi ... mp;start=0

                
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clipper*joe
Post ID: 389685by clipper*joe » Jun 16, 2013 - 12:56 PM PST
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Purple#Gold wrote:
Quote:
good point, a trade with us won't happen. dwight will just walk out, leaving lakerland with nothing in return.

Besides an extra 20 million in cap space for 2014 lol.

And a stupid pipe dream to get LBJ or any restricted free agent that will just match.

Oh, and you do know that once you go below the cap, you can't exceed it...Right? That means if you sign Kobe for 10 million a year, it comes out of the 20 million you think is funny.

                
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AirGriffin
Post ID: 389704by AirGriffin » Jun 16, 2013 - 01:36 PM PST
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They already stated and tweeted "the Clippers will NOT be trading Griffin". They did this to squash this crazy rumor immediately. I'm confused as to why this is still alive and being discussed ... Reporters pull **** out if their ass. The FO and organization never even considered it or even talked about it. That's all it is, a real rumor with nothing legitimate to back it.

Blake is the face of the franchise and is a young superstar, why would they give them up when they just signed him to a 5 year extension? Lol.

                
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lobcityhawaii
Post ID: 389709by lobcityhawaii » Jun 16, 2013 - 01:39 PM PST
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The one person who voted yes is a laker fan...lol.

                
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keephopealive
Post Subject: Can a Capologist Explain This to Me? Post ID: 389721by keephopealive » Jun 16, 2013 - 01:51 PM PST
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With the new CBA I was under the impression that a team that was over the luxury threshold, not the cap, could not receive players back in a sign in trade.

If this is the case all this Howard/griffin talk would be pointless. I am just curious why none of the experts have caught this.

By the way the trade makes incredible sense for both teams. That's the point of trades, it should benefit both teams.

Some would say "the lakers would never trade so and so to the clippers", no one ever trades to teams to help them, each team is always looking out for their interests FIRST, and if the lakers feel the trade makes them better then they will do the trade.

                
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Clippersfan86
Post Subject: RE: Can a Capologist Explain This to Me? Post ID: 389725by Clippersfan86 » Jun 16, 2013 - 01:53 PM PST
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This is correct and why it was shot down immediately. The Lakers cannot receive ANY players in a S&T for Howard.

                
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Amnesty_David_Stern
Post ID: 389727by Amnesty_David_Stern » Jun 16, 2013 - 01:54 PM PST
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We trade Blake were stupid. Howard had a serious back injury a couple of seasons ago and that is really carrying on as of this past season.

                
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botev1921
Post Subject: RE: Can a Capologist Explain This to Me? Post ID: 389728by botev1921 » Jun 16, 2013 - 01:56 PM PST
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This comes to show what complete morons actually work in some american sites and pretend to be experts. The same morons, who predicted a 70-win season for a Lakers team with no bench 10 months ago!

                
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KP
Post Subject: Re: Can a Capologist Explain This to Me? Post ID: 389733by KP » Jun 16, 2013 - 02:08 PM PST
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great question!

I'm under the impression that the lakers could get under the luxury tax by making a few moves... like using the amnesty on world peace... they then would be able to make the move

but I'm no capologists so i could be wrong...

Agent 0 is poster whose reply I'm waiting for tbh

                
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keephopealive
Post Subject: Re: Can a Capologist Explain This to Me? Post ID: 389735by keephopealive » Jun 16, 2013 - 02:12 PM PST
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KP wrote:
keephopealive wrote:
With the new CBA I was under the impression that a team that was over the luxury threshold, not the cap, could not receive players back in a sign in trade.

If this is the case all this Howard/griffin talk would be pointless. I am just curious why none of the experts have caught this.

By the way the trade makes incredible sense for both teams. That's the point of trades, it should benefit both teams.

Some would say "the lakers would never trade so and so to the clippers", no one ever trades to teams to help them, each team is always looking out for their interests FIRST, and if the lakers feel the trade makes them better then they will do the trade.

great question!

I'm under the impression that the lakers could get under the luxury tax by making a few moves... like using the amnesty on world peace... they then would be able to make the move

but I'm no capologists so i could be wrong...

Agent 0 is poster whose reply I'm waiting for tbh

Aha didn't think of that, I remember a piece that espn wrote that outline how the lakers could sign CP3, and it involved like 20 hoops the lakers would have to jump through in order to do it. I guess while unlikely the lakers could do this trade, not likely but possible.

                
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Hooch20
Post ID: 389743by Hooch20 » Jun 16, 2013 - 02:33 PM PST
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The Lakers can S/T out Howard and take players back. They can take back any player already under contract (Griffin & Bledsoe). They just can't receive a player that is signing a new contract (CP3).

                
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clipper*joe
Post ID: 389748by clipper*joe » Jun 16, 2013 - 02:45 PM PST
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Exactly right.

                
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KP
Post ID: 389749by KP » Jun 16, 2013 - 02:48 PM PST
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sounds like we should be trading Caron and not Blake

                
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keephopealive
Post ID: 389768by keephopealive » Jun 16, 2013 - 03:45 PM PST
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Wrong, I found my answer.

Starting in 2013-14, the team receiving the player cannot be above the "apron" ($4 million above the tax level) after the trade1, 2. A team above the apron can receive a player in a sign-and-trade if the trade reduces the team's payroll and the team finishes the trade below the apron.

"Apron" is $74 million. Lakers payroll is $78 million and $90 million after receiving Blake,therefore they would need to cut around $19 million to be able to do the Howard/griffin S&T.

                
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keephopealive
Post ID: 389769by keephopealive » Jun 16, 2013 - 03:46 PM PST
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clipper*joe wrote:
Hooch20 wrote:
The Lakers can S/T out Howard and take players back. They can take back any player already under contract (Griffin & Bledsoe). They just can't receive a player that is signing a new contract (CP3).

Exactly right.

Eaxactly wrong.

                
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wessleejr
Post ID: 389776by wessleejr » Jun 16, 2013 - 04:03 PM PST
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Nothing new yet i'm here hoping that there is an update.

                
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Jerediscool
Post ID: 389777by Jerediscool » Jun 16, 2013 - 04:09 PM PST
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keephopealive wrote:
clipper*joe wrote:
Hooch20 wrote:
The Lakers can S/T out Howard and take players back. They can take back any player already under contract (Griffin & Bledsoe). They just can't receive a player that is signing a new contract (CP3).

Exactly right.

Eaxactly wrong.

No, Joe and Hooch are totally right

                
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Voyeur
Post ID: 389778by Voyeur » Jun 16, 2013 - 04:10 PM PST
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I'll bet Kobe wishes this deal would happen. lol

                
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keephopealive
Post ID: 389780by keephopealive » Jun 16, 2013 - 04:23 PM PST
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Maybe......

                
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keephopealive
Post ID: 389782by keephopealive » Jun 16, 2013 - 04:25 PM PST
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  1. Can a free agent be signed and immediately traded?

There is a rule that allows teams to re-sign their own free agents for trading purposes, called the sign-and-trade rule. Under this rule the player is re-signed and immediately traded to another team. This is done by adding a clause to the contract stipulating that the contract is null and void if the trade to the specific team is not completed within 48 hours. To qualify for a sign-and-trade, all of the following must be true:

The player must re-sign with his prior team -- a team cannot include another team's free agent in a sign-and-trade. The player must finish the preceding season with that team (deals are no longer allowed that sign-and-trade players who are out of the league, such as the sign-and-trade that sent Keith Van Horn from Dallas to New Jersey as part of the Jason Kidd trade in 2008). The player cannot be a restricted free agent who has signed an offer sheet with another team (see question number 43). Starting in 2013-14, the team receiving the player cannot be above the "apron" ($4 million above the tax level) after the trade1, 2. A team above the apron can receive a player in a sign-and-trade if the trade reduces the team's payroll and the team finishes the trade below the apron. Starting in 2013-14, the team cannot receive a player in a sign-and-trade if they have used the Taxpayer Mid-Level exception (see question number 25) that season.1 The trade must be completed prior to the first game of the regular season (sign-and-trades are not allowed once the season begins). The player cannot be signed using the Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level exception, the Taxpayer Mid-Level exception, or any exception that cannot be used to offer a three-year contract (see question number 25). A sign-and-trade deal can be made with a free agent who has been renounced, as long as all the above criteria are met. Sign-and-trade contracts must be for at least three seasons (not including any option year) and no longer than four seasons. The first year of the contract must be fully guaranteed, but the remaining seasons can be non-guaranteed. The combination of a three-year minimum with a one-year guarantee ensures that the player's new team cannot acquire the player's Bird rights any sooner than if they had signed him directly (if they wanted to re-sign him in less than three years they would first have to waive him, and lose any Bird rights -- see question number 32).

The starting salary in a contract signed for a sign-and-trade may be any amount up to the player's maximum, however if the player meets the 5th Year 30% Max criteria (see question number 17) he cannot receive a salary greater than 25% of the cap. Raises are limited to 4.5%. The player may be considered to have a lower outgoing salary for trade purposes, which can complicate the trade (see question number 87).

If a sign-and-trade contract contains a signing bonus, then either team can pay it. By default the team that signs the player pays the signing bonus (as with any other contract), but since a sign-and-trade is in essence a contract with the receiving team, the teams can agree that the receiving team will pay it. Any portion that is paid by the signing team counts toward the team's annual limit for cash included in a trade (see question number 95), which in effect limits the portion of the signing bonus that can be paid by the signing team.

If a sign-and-trade contract contains a trade bonus, then the bonus is not earned upon the trade that accompanies the signing, but rather on the first subsequent trade. See question number 93 for more information on how long a team must wait before they can trade a player.

1 These teams are free to send players to other teams in sign-and-trade transactions, or to receive players in sign-and-trade transactions who weren't signed-and-traded themselves. Also, the restriction applies only to the sign-and-trade transaction itself -- teams are free to acquire players who had been signed-and-traded in earlier transactions. 2 A different team salary definition is used for determining whether a team is above or below the apron -- see question number 14 for details. Starting in 2013-14 if a team acquires a player in a sign-and-trade, the apron ($4 million above the tax line) effectively becomes a hard cap for the remainder of that season.

                
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clipper*joe
Post ID: 389787by clipper*joe » Jun 16, 2013 - 05:06 PM PST
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Starting in 2013-14, the team receiving the player cannot be above the "apron" ($4 million above the tax level) after the trade1

The team RECEIVING (S&T player) the player cannot be above the apron. That means the Lakers cannot receive a S&T'd player since they're above the apron...Get it? That also means the Lakers can sign and trade Howard and receive players in that transaction that are not newly sign and traded...Get it? A team above the apron can receive a player in a sign-and-trade if the trade reduces the team's payroll and the team finishes the trade below the apron.

That means that the lakers can receive a S&T player if that takes them below the apron at the end. meaning they trade Howard salary for a low salary player that has bird rights but is a FA. In that situation, the lakers are allowed to RECEIVE a S&T player if it takes them below 74 million.

You need to understand RECEIVE in the context it is put in. Very Happy

                
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clipper*joe
Post ID: 389788by clipper*joe » Jun 16, 2013 - 05:07 PM PST
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keephopealive wrote:
Jerediscool wrote:
No, Joe and Hooch are totally right

Maybe......

No, not maybe. We're right and you're wrong.

                
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keephopealive
Post ID: 389789by keephopealive » Jun 16, 2013 - 05:13 PM PST
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clipper*joe wrote:
keephopealive wrote:
Jerediscool wrote:
No, Joe and Hooch are totally right

Maybe......

No, not maybe. We're right and you're wrong.

Maybe......

The clippers are not under the apron. At least not yet they would have to renounce the rights to ALOT of players.

So you are wrong, clippers can not do this S/T UNLESS x,y and z happens first.

                
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tense2
Post ID: 389790by tense2 » Jun 16, 2013 - 05:14 PM PST
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^Yep, I learned what "receive" means in another thread, lol. CJ and Hooch are absolutely right.

                
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