Players Clippers Need to Succeed- Arron Afflalo, Kyle Korver

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Amnesty_David_Stern
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Hopefully we can get this thread rolling and get some positive and realistic input here but these are the things I think we need to succeed.

First off, let's assume that Eric Bledsoe is going to be traded. As much as we'd like it to be DJ instead of Bledsoe, in a trade that gives us cap relief and the ability to say sign Bledsoe to an extension, I think DJ is here to stay, at least temporarily.

Let's also stipulate that Crawford, no matter what is coming off the bench. Crawford is extremely talented on offense, his ball handling skills and ability to isolate and score are almost the best in the league. He seems content with his role here and serves a giant purpose off the bench. Seems his role has been solidified over the past few years in Atlanta and Portland.

But what do we need?

We need CP3 to sign a long-term deal with this team, yeah I'm no idiot that's priority #1. We should also be looking to ink Matt Barnes to a 2-4 year deal. If we can't find a solid SG or SF to start for us next year, Barnes can play either position, or be the "7th" man for us. He seems to be a big fan favorite and he played very well this past season.

And I'd hate to see Caron here and he starts over Barnes. Butler to me, at least at this point in his career has lost his ability to get assists on a regular basis, he lacks intensity to get to the basket and wants to spot up for 3PT'rs or jumpers. That kind of player who is nearly immobile on offense needs to come off the bench.

So far, we've got CP3 to a long-term deal, we are keeping DeAndre and we've locked in Barnes for at least 2 more years.

We need to secure a SG or a SF that can start by shipping off Bledsoe. Caron Butler also must be included in the deal as there aren't many starting SG's or SF's out there that make Bledsoe's salary or less that teams are willing to part with.

I am just going to go simple here and say we make a deal with Orlando for Arron Afflalo. That fills a need at SG and allows us to use Willie Green, whose done well here to come off the bench, or spot start if need be. Giving us 4 of our starting 5 for the season, a 6th man in Crawford and a 7th man or possible starter in Barnes.

After all the trades and the re-signing of CP3, I am not sure if we will have the money, but I'd really consider going after a guy like Kyle Korver on a 2-3 year deal. He can play SF and although he isn't a defensive monster, Afflalo and CP3 can take over defensive duties on the tougher PG, SG and SF's that other teams may have. Nobody really has all 3 of those positions that require spot on defense that would expose Korver's lack of solid defense too much.

Korver is a 3PT machine, and also a scoring machine as well. Combined with Afflalo and CP3's ability to score from just about anywhere, it should open up the post a lot more for Blake, and allow DJ to slip in unnoticed for easy dunks or layups. Another guy to go after would be someone like J.J. Redick, who will probably get a 7 mill a year deal from a poor or mid-level team. But, we can dream can't we?

I think for the SF spot ( again, assuming we trade for Afflalo ) should go to either a 3PT specialist/offensive dynamo, or to be given to Matt Barnes. This leaves us with open spots on our bench...

Lamar Odom should be in the mix as a returning bench guy if he can take a pay cut. Odom hasn't played well at all his past 2 years and the dreams of making the All-Star team are way behind him. However, he can still play all 5 positions on the floor and seems to be in a better place back home in Los Angeles. Odom is a solid rebounder, great passer for a big man and in a 8-21 minute a night role, can provide Blake and DJ with relief, and allow us to utilize his abilities as a great big man passer that KG was in Boston under new coach Doc Rivers. Question is, will he take less money to stay home and contend for a team, or will he take more money to potentially play for another playoff team and get a bigger role?

After CP3 though, I really feel that our biggest need is a bruiser down low. Or at least a bruiser or dirty player on the wings. I'd prefer us to get a tough guy who doesn't take crap to play in the paint. I want this guy to have little to no offensive ability at all, but be a punisher in the paint. Someone who is going to hard foul those weak little guards out there that step into his perimeter known as the Clipper paint. We need a guy whose physical, will fight for rebounds and help give this team a reputation like the 70's Philadelphia Flyers, the 90's Knicks and Dennis Rodman himself.

I am not sure who is out there that would step into this kind of role, but we need someone who isn't a wuss to be down low. Someone who will give flying elbows like Charles Barkley when he rebounds, to chatter on defense to get inside the heads of opposing players. Someone who gets technicals and isn't afraid to get fined. This is where we really miss Reggie Evans.

The rest of our bench needs to be filled out with complete specialists who are 1 or 2 dimensional at best. If the team and Chauncey himself wants to come back, he should have a very limited role in 8-15 minutes a night, as a floor general and a spot up shooter from mid/long range. If we don't bring back Chauncey, get a PG who can play good defense and pass the ball well, who won't need shots to feel he's effective. This is where I miss players like Eric Snow, or could use a guy like Eric Maynor or Earl Watson.

Guards and Small Forwards who excel at perimeter defense and/or 3PT shooting are a must. Get at least 1 guy whose basically our Steve Novak to bomb 3PT'rs if we don't get a guy like Korver or Redick. Get a guy who can play good defense to play the 2 or the 3.

I'd also like to fill out the team with at least 1 other, defensive-minded PF/C. Ronny Turiaf can be looked at to fill this spot. Although under-sized, he's a good blocker and can rebound.

The team needs to realize, Miami, the Bulls in the 90's, the Spurs and other teams in the past had guys on their bench that weren't just overall OK at everything, but had specialists to fill their team. The Heat have guys like Juwon Howard who are clearly leaders to their team, Shane Battier and Mike Miller who deliver corner 3PT'rs like daggers, Chris Anderson and Joel Anthony who are primarily there to block shots and clog the paint.

Don't go after around average, or average players who can do a little bit of everything, that's what Crawford, Odom and Barnes can do with their respective positions. Specialists is what it will come down to come crunch time.

Would you rather have a guy who can score when needed, play defense when needed etc etc or would you rather have a 2nd unit of guys who know exactly what their jobs are, and are out there for specific purposes, who allow the team to run certain plays and go under a certain strategy?

Lastly, any new players we bring in must hit at least 60% of their free throws minimum. We suck at free throws. Outside of 3 guys ( CP3, Chauncey and Crawford ) I'm petrified when anyone goes to the line, literally.

Long I understand, but hopefully it's a solid post.

Agent0
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1) High level defense / Defensive system

2) Better spacing, especially in the front court

3) Solid defenders on the wing

4) A wing scorer that can maybe get to the line a bit

toohipcliptoslip
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It's a bit too early because we don't know what Doc wants.

First Odom must go. He was a great rebounder but to paraphrase Lawler the ball moved better when Hill was playing. What's he going to do with Bledsoe? He may keep him at least for a year. He could be more valuable albeit more expensive than Jamal. Bledsoe is a potential 20ppg player. Maybe let Jamal go. He's streaky and can't defend. If Bledsoe and be a Ginobli and play starter minutes at 1 and 2 trade Jamal and Butler

Agent0
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Thats pushing it, especially on this team and without any ability to shoot off the dribble.

He put up 14.9 pts/36, 14.2 pts in 34 MPG in his 12 games as a starter. A jump to 20 pts is a lot, it should mean a significant improvement in shooting at the least.

Markojaric
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Agree with a lot of things. Great post, seriously. With that being said, Some things that im not sold 100% or want to give another point of view:

About Barnes: 4 years extension seems kind of a stretch. Maybe 2 with non guaranteed money on 3rd could work. And yes, part of the MLE would have to be taken.

Butler is gone, hopefully. Love tuff juice, the broken hand playing and the first big FA to sign here in a while, but we need another things right now. A question we should be asking to ourselves is: "Is Matt Barnes a quality starter as SF on its own?"

About the AA trade, Im not so sure how to distribute minutes with Paul, Crawford, Afflalo, Green and Billups (if he returns, but I guess we are getting a good and cheap backup PG). But well, I hope Doc knows best. And I really dont like the idea of playing Afflalo as a SF

About getting a sniper: I guess someone like Anthony Morrow would be more realistic. Korver and Redick are not gonna to renounce on money, I guess. As a spot up shooter only, even a rookie could fit the role.

Odom wont get anything but a vets min, here and Id like to say anywhere. Im pretty sure nobody on their right minds would spend more than that on him. Like his pick and roll D, his rebounding rate and his versatility. Praying that his offense awakens some day. I dont think hed wear another jersey at this point. Except Miami to get a ring, of course (?)

As a bruiser on the wings we have Barnes. Afflalo and Bledsoe (considering we have one of the two) are good perimeter defenders. Zaza Pachulia would be a decent enforcer, or Ivan Johnson if you want to trade the #25. Free agency options are crucial here. We picked Martin from FA a couple of years before and it worked. Heat did the same with Birdman.

Turiaf gets cut, IMHO. hustling is nice, but if hustling doesnt make you gain the rebound because you dont have the size or technique to do it, it doesnt help the team. Love Ronny, but Id rather have another player. Ideally, a Center who can play very good D and has a nice jumper. Rare commodity, of course. So Im hoping DJ improves badly and to have a plan if Defenses Clog the paint against our big men.

One of Spurs keys was versatility. It seems that with Pop their guys can do everything. The versatile-specialized players debate could be argued for a while.

jarca
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Since we'll be defensively oriented team I think we need a long, athletic defender at the 2 and 3 spot who can also run and slash through the basket

Rudy3203
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  1. Trade Bledsoe and Butler for Afflalo and Nicholson- Afflalo would be a defensive stopper at the shooting guard position and also be our best perimeter shooter. Nicholson would take Odom's spot in the rotation. He is a much better shooter then Odom. He could basically be playing next to Blake or DJ for 24 minutes per night, and help spread the floor.

  2. Draft Reggie Bullock with the 25th pick. In a interview, Doc emphasized today that the Clippers will be looking for a shooter in the draft. Bullock fits the bill hitting 2.6 threes per game at UNC last season while converting 43% of them.

  3. Sign Pierce with the MLE.

  4. Sign Jermaine O'Neill, Chauncey Billups and Ryan Hollins to minimum contracts.

-Having Nicholson and O'Neill off the bench will ensure a big opposite of Blake or DJ whenever one of them is out of the game. This is key for floor spacing. Nicholson and O'Neill are both also above average shot blockers, which helps with the defense. Hollins provides another athletic big off the bench that has played for Doc before.

-Afflalo/Bullock gives us two very good spot up shooters that will only be asked to knock down open shots and play solid defense.

-Pierce and Crawford are two guys that are known to create offense. They could both score in bunches.

-Then we still have CP!

david
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The more guys the Clippers can get who can shoot AND is a good defender, the better the team will be. Those guys are hard to find, but Arron Afflalo certainly is such a player. Kyle Korver is an excellent shooter but not so great defensively. Matt Barnes- good defender but outside shooting is a little too streaky. Caron Butler- good shooter, but defensively is getting a step slow.

Not saying that we can't win without guys who can both shoot/score and defend, but we certainly need more of those type of players to go deeper in the playoffs. You look the Spurs and the Heat- they have several key guys on the roster who can D up and put the ball through the hoop. If we could get one guy who plays starter minutes who can shoot/score to replace one of our mediocre guys, that would be nice. Now if we added TWO such players, this team will certainly be a championship contender.

toohipcliptoslip
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Every one of our guys are streaky.I would take a sharpshooting mediocre defending SF over a PF. We don't need a bench guy, we need a starter.

As far as Jermaine O Neil he's had injury problems his whole career. Anyway we don't need more medicare eligible guys.

toohipcliptoslip
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Agent0 wrote:
toohipcliptoslip wrote:
It's a bit too early because we don't know what Doc wants.

First Odom must go. He was a great rebounder but to paraphrase Lawler the ball moved better when Hill was playing. What's he going to do with Bledsoe? He may keep him at least for a year. He could be more valuable albeit more expensive than Jamal. Bledsoe is a potential 20ppg player. Maybe let Jamal go. He's streaky and can't defend. If Bledsoe and be a Ginobli and play starter minutes at 1 and 2 trade Jamal and Butler

Thats pushing it, especially on this team and without any ability to shoot off the dribble.

He put up 14.9 pts/36, 14.2 pts in 34 MPG in his 12 games as a starter. A jump to 20 pts is a lot, it should mean a significant improvement in shooting at the least.

He needs a good coach. He has put up 20+ points. I think his highest is 23. AS far as shooting he was a pass first slash second shoot third guy. We don't know how well he can shoot

bullterrierclipsfan1349
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if karasev is on the board, id take him over bullock. 19 years old and already a korver like shooter with length and high bball IQ. i like the ebled trade, because we may get an unprotected first rd pick from the magic as well as nicholson and afflalo for butler and ebled. however, i don't feel comfortable with billups being the back up point guard, but if he takes the minimum then thats good. other than that, you are spot on.

Agent0
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I don't really understand. Players that average a certain amount of points don't get that every game, so sure, once in a while he can put up 20 pts, of course. 61% of his FG attempts were jumpshots, he just missed a whole lot of them. He shot 34.7% on 343 jumpshots attempts. I think we have a pretty good idea of what kind of jumpshooter he is.

TheThinkingSomething
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Reggie Evans would be the perfect compliment to Crawford off the bench. If we could sign Chauncey to a vet. min. contract, Evans would help even more. Reggie gives shooters even more confidence and leeway to shoot because he gobbles up rebounds on missed shots. If Odom will come back for 2 mil or less, I'd say sign him, he or Reggie could split the MLE with Barnes. Sign a filler, backup center (Hollins will do) for the vet. min. and the bench is set.

For the starting unit, I'd make every effort to sign or trade for Eric Gordon, Arron Afflalo or OJ Mayo in that order. EJ is expensive and will be for a while, but we know what he is capable of and we could get him for cheaper right now since he is coming off of a string of injuries (we might be able to get him for Bled and 2 first rounders). He is also very strong on defense and gets to the foul line often, which is something we completely lost from both of our starting SG's last season. Afflalo would be next on the list because he doesn't get to the foul line or penetrate to the hoop as often, but does, however, have pluses in his very low turnover rate and solid spot up shooting. After this, trade Butler for Ariza straight up to get younger at the 3 spot and get ready for wins.

toohipcliptoslip
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Poetic license?

pageC4
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Things have changed now that we have Doc though. The consensus around sports analysts is that the Clippers are a major player with Doc as our general. I wouldn't be surprised if this acquisition will help lure players here.

clips15deep
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That is a great point, you have to space the floor in order to make a run in the playoffs now.

Rudy3203
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I agree that Afflalo/Korver is a good plan to improve our spacing. However, I think we could get a head start in that by drafting Reggie Bullock with the 25th pick. Bullock is a Korver type player, only he is a better defender and rebounder. I would then sign Pierce with the MLE. If Pierce is not available, then I would turn my attention to signing Barnes with part of the MLE. Maybe 3years/12million. This would give us a good combo of offense/defense at the 3.

Markojaric
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The thing with Korver and Redick is that if they come here, theyd be declining their only shot in their career to make big bucks (Thats the same reason Barnes wont resign with us for the minimum).

Is a Money vs Championship ambitions thing.

bullterrierclipsfan1349
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^ korver and reddick made 5.5 million and 6 million respectively, way different scenarios to what barnes made.

Rudy3203
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I think 3years/12million for Barnes will work.

bullterrierclipsfan1349
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^ we can't offer him that much since we don't have his bird rights

toohipcliptoslip
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Morrow $4 mill last yr

toohipcliptoslip
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I don't think Barnes would take less than two

Rudy3203
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Sure we can. But, we would have to use part of our mid level exception for him, that's the only thing. But there isn't really any impact level small forwards available for the MLE any way, so we might as well us it on Barnes.

Agent0
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We can if we use almost all the MLE on him, which I don't think would be wise, but because of his energy, I think people forget that Barnes is 33 years old. i mean seems like a lot of people on the forum are so scared of old players yet would want to sign a 33 year old Barnes to a 3 year contract? He'll be 36 when that contract is over.

I think being a role player and being 33 years old, the Clippers should tread lightly in terms of any length they give to Barnes in a contract.

Morrow would come cheap, but he does suck on defense. It was very interesting that the Nets couldn't find a place for him.

Rudy3203
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Assuming that Pierce's contract is not bought out and thus being made available with the MLE. Use of the MLEvwould basically have to come down to Barnes or Korver for us, I think.

Amnesty_David_Stern
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Korver has played for like 8 or 9 years I believe. Getting a large contract is probably still on the table even if he plays say 2-3 years here. Some guys really want to win something and not play on teams that don't have a realistic shot at the Finals. We are the 3rd ranked team according to the oddsmakers in Vergas to win the title. That will have sway in who wants to come here.

ClipperKyle32
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Well this is interesting seeing some guys were still talking about Reddick years ago

FightOnRon
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I was interested about the topic and thought before I opened it,geez we are succeeding fairly well right now,what does this guy want now? then I realized we are revisiting a year old thread.

CP3Heliflopter
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Well I definitely would have liked Korver lol. 3 point machine. Would help us soooooooo much.

toohipcliptoslip
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This team needs one thing only. For DJ to be able to score in the paint rather than just picking up the trash. This is not a criticism or a put down because he's done great but he could have really gotten the Dallas bigs in foul trouble. Lawler agrees. With BG and DJ in the post we're unstoppable.

clipperboy24
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I have always thought the key is having dominant bigs. You just can't stop a team with two bigs who can score and one being a defensive anchor. You may not win it every year but will always be in the hunt with that. Drob and Duncan were a perfect example.

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