Danny Granger or Matt Barnes or Jared Dudley to Start @ SF? (P. 3)

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JQuick32
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Pacer fans really aren't happy about the Granger trade right now.... over on their board, they're wondering if the lack of loyalty shown to him by the Pacers is a reason for their current slump.

ClippersDA
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I was going to say maybe we signed the heart of the pacers haha

CP3Heliflopter
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Funny how people though Evan Turner was going to be a difference maker. He was a no defense playing chucker who puts up mediocre numbers on a horrendous team.

Basically a rich man's Mullens as far as I am concerned.

wessleejr
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Indy just lose 26 point in Houston, they are just lucky when they beat us. The way we play now it's not scary anymore whoever we face in the playoff.

puddnhead83
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The Pacers are trying to get Evan Turner some minutes and that is causing problems with the chemistry. Since the team is playing well with Matt Barnes starting why mess with a good thing.

ClipperKyle32
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I said that a few days ago. I believe Danny Granger was that player that kept that whole team together. Pacers trade Granger and get Turner. Everyone was like Pacers are a lock for Finals. Now their team has fallen apart. Granger looked good the other night.

I am currently watching the Thunder play the Lakers. I want to see how Caron does against the Lakers in comparison to how Granger played against the Lakers.

Granger and Davis were the best signing for this team. When Granger get acclimated he will Start. I know i would start him

wessleejr
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OKC and Lakers on ABC i'm rooting for the Lakers to win, lol! their win will count in favor for us.

clipperAndrew
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as much as I thought Granger should start...Matt Barnes as proved me wrong the last 8 games. If Matt is playing like this, no way should we take him out of the starting line up right now.

JahvonTheClip
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Matt could really help the bench more than granger that is why he needs to come off the bench

wessleejr
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Or vice versa Danny could help the bench with Jamal and Big Baby.

clipperAndrew
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I think Matt could help the bench, but why take him out of the starting line up now when he is doing so well. Talk about a shot to his confidence.

Agent0
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Matt could help any lineup and is currently playing very well with the starters, no need to mess with that.

Granger should be okay with the bench also, and hopefully his shooting improves as we move forward. 3 games and 6 3PA tells us nothing. Interested to see where his production is 10-15 games in.

Dudley back healthy should be good with the bench as the PF or whatever, the other forward along with Granger.

pageC4
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Split the minutes like last year. Barnes and Butler were splitting the minutes at an almost 50-50 time percentage. Barnes has been playing superb and Granger can use this time to get his shooting down. Bottom line Dudley needs to have 0 minutes.

pageC4
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lol, no he was rotting there. It would be like us jettisoning Dudley and suddenly he plays like the Phoenix Dudley. Sometimes things don't go as planned, and a new environment helps a player. Dudley just doesn't fit here...at all. I wish him the best, but if he gets traded in the off season and he does well on his new team it won't make me think we made a mistake.

Matt Barnes is also a player who had a similar case. He was not exactly playing all that well on the Lakers. In fact the Lakers made no attempt to resign him. The Clippers give him a chance after CP3 chimes in about Barne's ability, and lo and behold he is a perfect fit here. Sometimes players don't work in certain organizations...Dudley is a clear example.

MunoValente
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Splitting Barnes and Butler equal was a mistake last year because Barnes was clearly better, we should have started Barnes and played him more than Butler. Barnes is clearly better than Granger so far this year. I'm in no hurry for Doc to recreate VDN coaching decisions.

Anyone expecting Dudley's minutes to go down to 0 minutes will be disappointed, especially after Turkoglu's impressive 0 point, 0 rebound performance and fabulous late game inbound play last night.

jarca
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Turgolu earns minimum wage and played less 10 minutes. He did get one assist.

Dudley earns 4 million and once put out 0 points 0 a assist 1 rebound in 21 freaking minutes.

CapsNClips
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Wait, Hedo gets paid only $8 an hour? That's a really good deal.

MunoValente
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None of that changes that Doc's recent sub patterns seem to favor Dudley to Turkoglu in that role, if Dudley isn't getting minutes at SF. Maybe Turkoglu deserves it more ,maybe not, but Dudley has gotten minutes over him lately in important games like OKC and Houston.

Their salaries are pretty much irrelevant at this point in the season.

Agent0
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Lol, no wonder Turkoglu looks so skinny. If he's only making $8/hr and works like 15 hours a week, he probably mainly eats when the team provides food.

Icecoldclipper
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I'm for the time split between Granger and Barnes and I think Granger's confidence would sky rocket once starting.

ClippersDA
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I just love seeing granger out there

namzug
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I was one that voted for starting Granger, but you can't mess with Matt right now. He is playing out of his mind, and unless Granger surpasses and think that the Chemistry would work better with Granger then you go that route. I'm ok with splitting their minutes maybe 55% to Matt and 45% to Danny with garbage minutes going to Duds. I think Reggie should get more playing time at the two while Jamal is out, because if JJ doesn't get back this season it would be nice to have some type of insurance.

jarca
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Well, i hope Dudley continues his hustle once he gets back from injury if he's going to continue to,get minutes. Doc now,has an influx of talents on each position. Not a bad problem to have.

GrangerFan
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You guys are seeing what Granger can do for you tonight if you just give him the minutes and shot opportunities. He's a little slower but that might still be coming back but he's just a such a smart player that does many things well. He's a very good defender and an example of why defense isn't all about athleticism. Just get him 25 minutes and 10 shots and good things happen. I was never in favor of the Pacers moving Granger and thought he'd most likely be the better player between he and Turner by the end of the season, I think that's the case now but on top of that the Pacers now have to overcome the chemistry issue they're facing in losing the team captain that had been there for almost 9 years.

MunoValente
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I like that we did both Barnes/Granger SG/SF and SF/PF lineups, this gives us a lot flexibility. Bullock and Dudley being able to play multiple positions works with this too.

Laak
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There's no question he can still produce offensively. However, his defense may be an issue. As a perimeter player, you do need athleticism for defense or else the opponents would just blow by you. From what I've been watching thus far, his speed is almost comparable to Dirk's. 25 minutes a night is fine, he'll give us solid scoring off the bench, just don't start him.

jarca
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I think as of right now, Dudley is at the bottom of the totem pole for SF

GrangerFan
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At this point I think that's a good comparison speed wise however I think defense goes a lot farther then athleticism. Granger's game has never been about speed even in his all star year but he's always been a very good defender. When I compare him to Paul George and Lance Stephenson with the Pacers, he's a step below PG who IMO is one of the best perimeter defenders in the NBA but considerably better then Stephenson who is far more athletic. I've only watched a few Clippers games but from what I've seen you wouldn't' be losing anything defensively between Granger and Barnes. Right now I'd say Granger's best use defensively is against quicker 4's and bigger 3's like Lebron.

MunoValente
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There just aren't that many good SFs that rely on blowing by people with speed, a lot like to post up or use their strength to power to the basket and a lot more are mostly spot shooters. Lebron, Melo and Durant are all more post players/shooters than guys that dribble around people, Lebron likes to dribble through people when he does face up.

George is the one guy that relies on using his speed to beat people. If you look back at earlier in the when Barnes hurt and we were relying on limping Dudley, George is the one guy that really hurt us; Durant just did his usual thing and we did really well defending Melo and Lebron earlier in the year.

Strength, positioning and decision making can go a long way on defense and so far Granger has those things down. Mobility is great tool have too, but there are ways work around it.

namzug
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I agree with Muno about the strength, positioning going a long way on defense. I think Granger has been rotating correctly, putting a body on someone when a shot goes up, covering the paint in transition, rebounding, closing out and getting in the passing lane quite well in the few games he's been with us. He isn't the fastest, and he can get beat one on one by a good offensive player but he does all the little things. He also filled in the missing piece off the bench while Crawford was down, and also think that him and Collison having some experience playing together will help once Craw gets back.

jarca
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Guess who was guarding George? Dudley.

Jcross did better guarding George than Dudley in the first game.

MunoValente
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And Crawford would do a better job because he's faster, but he's weak, but George doesn't use his strength much. That doesn't apply to someone like Melo and Lebron though. Durant is completely different because he's freakishly tall for his position. Different players require different tools to defend, but for the most part there aren't a lot of good SF that rely primarily on quickness to score, so a stronger, slower SF isn't going to be a problem most of the time, which is why Indiana's team defense tended to be better when Granger was on the floor this year.

kjavis
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Granger showing signs against PHX that he is ready to start

CP3Best
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I think it's clear that Danny Granger will start in the POs, 3 games in and already he's scoring and Very efficiently!

namzug
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I'm not sure, Matt is playing great with the starters and Danny has more freedom with the bench.

I'm a strong believer when you are talking about chasing a title and not any individual accolades it comes down to minutes rather than starting or not. I think for now Danny should keep coming off the bench because back up guys can't deal with his size at the 3 and Jamal has needed help off the bench all year. If Jamal has to start it still works out because I also think Danny plays great with Collison and they compliment each other. If we see that he just plays out of this world with the starters than we should make the change. I'm actually in between and might change my mind by next game, but just think as long as Matt is playing great then we keep it going and let Danny tear up back ups. If we stagger minutes they will all get a chance to benefit from playing with the other starters.

kjavis
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Once Barnes slows down back to his 'normal' self I can see Doc putting him back on the bench and Granger starting at the 3

wessleejr
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Honestly it's hard to choice now between Barnes and Granger to start, we need Barnes cutting and spot shooting, but Granger 2 games is also convincing.

CP3.VI
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i agree and am excited to see granger get more minutes.

slestack11
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I think its time to start Granger at SG until Redick comes back. We need Collison and eventually Crawford coming off the bench to secure the second unit.

StrikeBack
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I'm not sure Matt can produce the same way with the reserves. CP is always looking for open players, Matt's a great cutter, Blake requires double teams and it allows Matt to find the open spots. The starters tend to run a lot more and CP gets the ball to the right guy.

Darren just blazes ahead and what happens, happens. won't be too many double teams and open spots w/ the 2nd unit.

Clippers_FTW
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I'm not sure who is starting matters as much as who is finishing the game. But... In my opinion Granger is a starter. granger would be wasted with 2 ball dominant guards in Crawford and Collison. Barnes works because he doesn't need the ball in his hands to score. He can cut can grab rebounds and pick up some garbage. I'd much rather a wide open granger in the corner shooting 3s than Barnes. Also Granger can put the ball on the floor and create. He is also a much better passer (so good at times our teammates aren't even expecting the ball).

wessleejr
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That's what I'm thinking, Collison doesn't usually look for a cutter. Barnes is a good fit for CP3's style, because of his ability to find an open player or a cutter same as Blake. Danny Granger is better than Barnes in a one on one like Darren and Jamal. Big baby's game will fit to this three. Jamal doesn't need a big space to make a shot, With Big baby giving him a little pick can give Jamal effectivity.

ClippersDA
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Barnes looked like he was coming down to earth the other night - in the end I think granger will create more favorable matchups for us. He also seems to have good chemistry with blake already.

Icecoldclipper
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Any word on Dudley?

pageC4
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I love Matt Barnes. I'm glad we re-signed him, and despite his early season woes I always gave him more of a pass than a player like Dudley because Barnes has been and most likely always will be a bench player. I never gave that luxury to Dudley because he was brought in to be a starter.

The reason why I'm not keen on him(Barnes) starting now that Granger is signed is that he has a tendency to impact the game a lot through his decision to live and die by the 3. Since the trade deadline passed Barnes has been hitting 3's, but prior to that I would cringe when I would see him take them. Our wing players do need to be able to hit 3's with good consistency, and that's the problem I see with Barnes starting now that Granger is on this squad.

For the time being Barnes staring is not a problem, especially since we can find enough time for Grnager at the 2.

However, once Redick and Crawford come back I would like to see Granger slide in to the starters spot at the 3 and Barnes minutes reduced. And above all Dudley should have no minutes.

pageC4
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He is moving along nicely. In mondays game we were 0-2 beyond the arc before Granger got insert, but then that all changed once he was playing. Also, that length of his makes it difficult for other players to score. He had a very good block on one of the suns players.

CP3Best
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Speaking of length anyone notice how we put Big Baby with another pf, and then he really struggles against length on rebounds just tipping and tipping, I think we should insert Hollins in every once in a while with Baby, that'd help a lot.

MunoValente
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Looks like he's a game time decision again tonight. He probably mostly plays PF from here out, although if we use Granger/Barnes at SG he might be get SF minutes too.

ClipperPostman
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I watched every moment of big baby playing and I def didn't notice that.

jarca
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Granger isn't averaging 50 and the forum isn't turning on him Very Happy

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