Clippers vs Thunder 2014 - What Went Wrong? (P. 3)

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Griffinforpresident
Clipper 6th Man
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Why haven't we moved on from this thread?

ClipperKyle32
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I must say this. It is going to hurt me to watch these WCFs. Man we were so close. We missed a golden opportunity to go up 3-2 and Ibaka got injured. We could have....

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Agent0
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Clutch gene sometimes just means more skilled. If Blake was an elite shooter, he would have a "clutch gene" when in reality he would just be a much better shooter and vastly more confident and accurate in taking a variety of shots.

Agent0
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Butterfly effect. Does Ibaka still get injured if we win the previous game?

gman
Clipper All-Star
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Because most of us are still angry at the way it ended.

laboy
Clipper 6th Man
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there is no moving on...

we need to fix the problem..

drafting a player or getting a few new players won't fix it...

the owner has nothing to do with it..

it is the point guard and the coach who are responsible...

the fans pay good money to follow the team..

over $100 a ticket in the playoffs...for what...

to never get to the finals???

paul has been here 3 years..

lost to san antonio... second round

lost to memphis...first round

lost to oklahoma.....second round

almost lost to a hurt golden state team ...in the first round..

if their center was not hurt ...they would have beaten us in the first round..

san antonio is only getting better every year..

they have a great coach and a good system..

our coach got out coached this year by jackson and oklahomas coach..

he got owned!!!!!

Is he worth 7 million a year and a draft pick that we gave to boston???

ClipperRevival
Clipper 6th Man
Posts: 173
votes: 0

I don't think the team ever recovered from game 5. The refs sealed our fate with their one way calling. I mean it was Murphy's Law in the last minute. Every play that could've gone against us did. Until the day I die, I'm sure I'll get a sick feeling everytimr I see the out of bounds play.

gman
Clipper All-Star
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If we all know that the refs helped OKC. If we know that Tony brothers is hugging KDs mom before the game. If we know that Tony Brothers lied about the number of views he had on the out of bounds play (Article written on it). If we know that the explanation was absolutely BS. How come there was not enough to be taken to the NBA?? Why didn't the Clippers protest that game??? Would the NBA have the balls to replay that game???(mute point now).

I am still fuming about that. I am still on the what if (I know the team crumbed at end, but we deserved to win the game) the right call was made.

Some noise was made but NBA didn't care. So there en-lies BaadMasters' question....Is the NBA fixed??

toohipcliptoslip
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Clutch is really being able to perform when you only have one chance and if you screw up it's all your fault but still you wan the ball. No matter how good you are if you don't have ice water for blood you can never be clutch. Two players may have the same skill set but under duress one is able to focus but the other gets adrenaline shaky and afraid. Wyatt Earp believed you should never quick draw. He drew his pistol took careful aim and fired and did it in a hail of bullets. That's clutch.

If you want clutch check out Greg Louganis' dive after cracking his head. He did the "Dive of Death" and nailed it

BaadMaster
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What about the last play, the Westbrick three pointer, that was way off and Chris BARELY touched him when the refs are supposed to "swallow their whistles" and let them play? But they "swallowed their corrupt, sniveling, lying whistles" when CP3 was fouled bringing up the ball. Talk about shceevy low lifes who wanted OKC to win at all costs.

As to clutch, does it count when the officials help you in a critical play? Was the KD "charge" instead of a "blocking" foul, was that "clutch?" Was knocking a ball out of bounds and still keeping possession a "clutch" play? Was Westbrook's off balance three that Chris Paul barely touched him, was that "clutch.?" Yes, the free throws were -- but they were a gift.

I remember Kobe Bryant had his own personal ref -- Violet Palmer -- who always bailed him out anytime he needed a "clutch" basket and missed. Sometimes her calls seemed like they were a half hour after the play. Is that "clutch?" It is "clutch" in much the same way as Westbrook's last three point attempt.

What is lacking here is a bonafide GROUP of great players all of whom should be given an "earned" ref-edge. I would not mind KD's calls if the stars on his opponent's teams also got helped by the officials. Chris Paul and BG should get the same ref-help as KD and Westy and then let's see who is truly "Mr. Clutch."

I am not sure, but someone defined "clutch" as not one play, but a whole game's worth of plays that put your TEAM in a position to win. By that definition, Chris and BG were clutch. Unfortunately, refs can often turn "clutch" into "mush" at their whim.

Therein lies my beef with the NBA.

Addendum: Last year, Manu missed what could have proved to be the series winning free throws? But is he not clutch? (And he's just gonna make up for it by winning this year.) Same with CP3 for next year. One play does not make you or break you as "Mr. Clutch." Otherwise Robert Horry would be the greatest clutch player of all time. And Manu the choker. That's not how it works.

Agent0
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For the most part clutch as most people think of it is fake. There are players who crumble under pressure and then there are just guys who are either good or not good. The better you are, certainly the more clutch you will seem. Blake doesn't seem like he's afraid of pressure situations, so for him, he just needs to be better at certain things to have the confidence to do them when it matters most.

Agent0
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Repped High Quality Post
there is no moving on... we need to fix the problem.. drafting a player or getting a few new players won't fix it... the owner has nothing to do with it.. it is the point guard and the coach who are responsible... the fans pay good money to follow the team.. over $100 a ticket in the playoffs...for what... to never get to the finals??? paul has been here 3 years.. lost to san antonio... second round lost to memphis...first round lost to oklahoma.....second round almost lost to a hurt golden state team ...in the first round.. if their center was not hurt ...they would have beaten us in the first round.. san antonio....

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JQuick32
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What he needs is the ball, instead of Jamal and CP3 hogging it down the stretch.

BaadMaster
Clipper Starter
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votes: 7

Funny!!! Repped.

laboy
Clipper 6th Man
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so you are saying that oklahoma has a better team than the clippers??

san antonio...yeah they are superstars and have tons of experience and trophies..but oklahoma with their one trick pony??

3 years the clippers had every great free agent coming to them..a first..

then signed 2 free agents in the off season..

bottom line....their coach did a terrible job..and the coach on the floor had some lapses..

they gave away the series...

If lebran came to the clippers ...he played with blake and dj and collision..they can get a championship next year!!

so believe what you like...the nba has changed a lot in 20 years...if players want out of a situation...then can get a trade..

they can play for less money...

and I have been a fan since 1988,so it has been a few more than 3 years for me.... Smile

FightOnRon
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I'm too old to dwell on this deal now, I have moved on. Another full year together, a couple of roster tweaks, we will move on.

gman
Clipper All-Star
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We have to remember that this was BGs first full year as a dangerous weapon. He is still raw in that department. CP is as clutch as you can get and Jamal can get off his own shot over anyone.

Next season Blake will get the ball more often in final minutes of close games. Blake got better overall in his 4th quarter performances as the season went on. I liked him in the final game of the playoffs. That is the Blake we need going forward (minus the foul trouble).

Clips84
Clipper 6th Man
Posts: 182
votes: 6

What went wrong was the Clippers is still an incomplete team.

Realize that DJ still has light-years away from becoming a dominant Center. Having an inside game and making FTs (the basics of all basics)

Yes he's improved this season under Doc, and we should expect him to improve even more.

Also, face it...Redick and Dudley were mistakes. Redick is great during the regular season, but when it comes to the playoffs, he was nowhere to be found. Undersized against bigger and stronger players and that running around through screens can be stopped in the playoffs.

Dudley became the new Gomes. That Is my explanation.

The Clippers need two very athletic SG and SF.

Plus, depth is still an issue.

At the end of the day, we all must realize that even though the Clippers went deep in the playoffs, they are still not in competition against the likes of OKC, SAN & MIA.

Clipperman#5
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I want everyone to see this & answer this if possible, do the rest of Clipper Nation agree with Bill Simmons that the trade of Eric Bledsoe & Caron Butler for JJ Redick & Jared Dudley really cost the Clippers the WCSF series Vs Thunder???

CP3Best
CTB MVP X2
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I really liked JJ, but for the deal to actually work, we needed Dudley to play like his former self. It was a good looking deal, cause we needed a sf and sg, Dudley looked like he could fit the system better than Butler, didn't pan out...

itsLuigi
Clipper Starter
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were we watching the same series? i thought redick was pretty good in the playoffs. he shot 41% from beyond the arc during the thunder series, when his career average is 39. he did what he was suppose to do. get the offense moving and hit 3s.

ClipperKyle32
CTB MVP X1
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Most people here only look at stats to determine whether a player did well or not. Its not all stats. Its the things that go without statistics.

itsLuigi
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my opinion on redick wasn't based on his stats alone, it was on his performance as well. i think played pretty well in the playoffs. he had off games just like everyone else but to say he was a no show is a little harsh.

Agent0
CTB MVP X1
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To be quite clear, I don't know what you mean by the free agent thing. They can play for less money, true, but doesn't mean they will. I don't even know what the Lebron thing means. Sure, Lebron is better than Paul, but the team would still have to go through OKC and SA, so it isn't like we just jump ahead of them if we added Lebron.

I don't know about giving away the series. We were at home in game 6 and OKC took it with Durants 39 points and solid play from their role players as well as timely drawn offensive fouls, Wink

OKC has a two trick pony, haha, but you're only thinking offense, OKC also defends, that's their third trick, they can actually play solid level defense. In this series their 4th trick was super efficient role players in comparison to our not so efficient role players. If you let their two guys go off, you have to match it. Paul did, Griffin couldn't over the series and it isn't a fault of his, it isn't easy and he started off the series trying to back down Ibaka. We scored a lot on them, but not so much because we shot well, but because they couldn't force us into many turnovers.

SA isn't about superstars, they have a team and they have balance. They have a great coach. They have long, athletic defensive wings who are coincidentally also good to very good perimeter shooters. They have a big man who is an elite defender in Duncan, and Splitter who people don't realize is also a very good defender. They have multiple solid shooters. They have solid versatile bench players in Ginobili and Diaw. SA can win with offense and with defense. This Clippers team in the playoffs for the most part only showed that they could win with offense, and that can work, don't get me wrong, and ask Phoenix, but it is certainly more reliable to be able to win with both offense and defense. Even then, Phoenix struggled with size and their defensive system was meh, but even they did have good to very good individual defenders (Bell, Marion, Jackson, Diaw, Thomas) on the wing and in the post (who mostly could shoot too), an area we are still lacking.

I know it has probably been for more than 3 years, but this current Clippers team and coaches and players have nothing to do with the other years. I'm talking about a continuity of team, your words were "paul has been here 3 years." and then you went on. If you expected Paul coming to mean finals in 3 years with a roster that wasn't even finals ready, you were overrating what one player is capable of doing.

BaadMaster
Clipper Starter
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votes: 7

Correction: "At the end of the day, we all must realize that even though the Clippers went deep in the playoffs, they are still not in competition against the likes of OKC and their refs, SAN & MIA." Now it reads correctly. (Not sure about Miami yet.)

ClipperKyle32
CTB MVP X1
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This is the first time I have seen this. First time I have watched replay of this game at all. As far as MIA,OKC, and SAS. We can beat them. bigger than Miami More athletic that SAS Better team....

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Icecoldclipper
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We are not beating SAS with our lack of length. Parker and Many would of attacked us over and over again and once we went small they would of had a raid of bigs.

laboy
Clipper 6th Man
Posts: 150
votes: 0

I meant that the clippers gave the series away..

oklahoma did nothing..clippers LOST!!!!

they were not focused..paul was not playing well...the substitutions were not great,the bench was not properly used..collison went from hero...to bench warmer..

he was like bledsoe in the memphis series..he added speed to our offense..our offense was very predictable...our bigs should have had more points..the spreading of the floor was poor..

when san antonio sweeps oklahoma..they will wonder what happened...???we beat the clippers and the grizzlies....well they did not..if Randolph played game 7...oklahoma probably would not have won,

and if paul had used his mind in time management and some drippling skills..the clippers would have beaten oklahoma..there is only next year...and what could have been this year..if blake cannot take over games in the playoffs and be a superstar next year...the clippers will be out of the playoffs once again...clearly paul is not the MAN. chris spent 6 years in new orleans...now 3 here,how many years does he need to be able to guide the clippers to the western conference finals??? 2019???

danielson
Clipper D-League Pickup
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A 6ft point guard and a 6'8 power forward will only take so far. Add a shooting guard at 6'4 that can only hit open jumpers and is a liability everywhere else. Plus small forwards that average 8 points game and is a turnover machine. A center who has no offensive game and can't hit a free throw. I know I'll get crucified on this board but I would seriously consider blowing the team up. We should do it now while blake, cp3 and dj have high trade value.

PaulSoleil
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There was obvious nudging of the games OKC's way. (see my post from my conversation with an NBA ref in the "is the NBA rigged" thread). Durant gave an emotional MVP speech and was the feel good story of the year. The Clippers have an a-hole for an owner that no onenwouldmhave felt great about his success. It's better for the league for OKC to move on. Yes, we missed shots, but Game 2 was an obvious gimme to OKC after the MVP award. Then Game 3 with the obviously foul on CP3 at the end of the game that wasn't called and then Game 5 with the obvious out of bounds that was given the wrong way. That's 2 games we should have won, that the officiating gave away.....not without some agenda. (We win those two games and the series is over). Game 2 was too far out of reach, obviously a gift for Durant.

Latrell Spreewell's brother always told me the games were rigged. That the NBA is a business more than a sport.

Now for Crawford....never been a fan. He hurts you with all his misses more than he helps you with the few spectacular shots. Get someone in there who can make just one more basket on all the attempts and despite the refs, we win game 3 and game 5

Agent0
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LOL. Blowing up the team and then what? Who are you going to get? How do you even get to anything close to the same level? You think you'll just have teams trade equally good or better players if you blow up a team?

Blake is 6'10, his reach is closer to that of a 6'8 guy, but he isn't 6'8.

If we blow up the team, what we'd get is a good glut of young, but no superstar talent players. We'd be capable of winning 50 games or so, but most likely a first round exit, and people will start saying "they need to trade some of their young talent for a superstar", then we are back to square one, because again, we aren't getting Lebron or Durant, and there aren't any other stars outside of those two that are really any better than our guys. Even the ones that most people would like, you aren't getting Curry or some young guy like Anthony Davis, so what exactly is accomplished?

Agent0
CTB MVP X1
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I don't buy giving no credit to the other team. We had an inconsistent shooter in Barnes as our SF and a suepr streaky and unreliable scorer in Jamal as our third best offensive option, our team is already built to have such inconsistencies. OKC defended well enough to keep us from shooting as well as they did. OKC had 2/3 best players in the series, OKC's role players hit their shots.

Those are the things they did. We just went through this, again you're saying how many years does he need to get to the WCF after three years when we just talked about the plethora of teams with as good or better players, and certainly a good amount with better teams than the Clippers who had more than 3 year spans without going past the first or second round. How are you still bringing this up again? lol

bebe
Clipper D-League Pickup
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Boo Hoo, Boo Hoo. Here's a tissue to blow your nose. The Clippers gave us a damn good season and I enjoyed every game. Of course it hurts when they lose and the last two with OKC was heartbreaking. Trying to put blame on any player doesn't justify why we lost. Now is the time to support the team not tear them down. Of course we're all entitled to our opinions but we have to move on. If you're still hurting can you imagine how the players feel? Let's not make them feel worse by posting negative comments. I believe after game 5 all the WIN was taken out of the players and the refs were the winners. Playing the game requires mental concentratioin and physical abillities, hopefully the players learned a big lession from this last series. Can't wait to see them on the floor again.

The Nevada Fans

danielson
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@agent0. Blake is 6'8. Just because he's listed at 6'10 doesn't mean he's that height. I bet you probably think Love is also 6'10. As much as I love seeing the guys play, this team was constructed all wrong. We were exposed again in the playoffs. I guarantee you if we come back another year with blake, cp3, dj, jj, and some fill in guys, we'll have another second round exit. I don't know who we would get back for blake, JJ and DJ but I do know we won't compete for any titles the way this team is put together. If, and that's a BIG IF. DJ develops a post game and hits his free throws. Plus we can steal a small forward that can average 15 a game with solid wing defense. Then we can compete with the top teams

CLIPSET
Clipper Starter
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This is the first time I have seen this. First time I have watched replay of this game at all.

As far as MIA,OKC, and SAS. We can beat them.

  1. bigger than Miami

  2. More athletic that SAS

  3. Better team than OKC.

But the athleticism is the only thing we got on SAS

Damn what a choke jobSMH

Agent0
CTB MVP X1
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I don't think Love is anything but I'd guess 6'9. Blake was measured at 6'8.5 add an inch for shoes, which is what players are listed in, their height with shoes, not without, since they play with shoes and we have 6'9.5, since player heights aren't listed with decimals, we have dun, dun, dun, 6'10 Wink

Now, if you were arguing that his height without shoes is 6'8, well, yea, it is.

Either way, his head height doesn't matter, Brand was actually 6'8 but was not undersized based on where his hands went up to. You don't play basketball with the top of your head.

laboy
Clipper 6th Man
Posts: 150
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are the nevada fans talking about the millionaires who play for the los angeles clippers?

boo hoo hoo!!!

they will be thinking about buying another million dollar house somewhere by the beach..

they are not thinking about what happened.,..

its all entertainment...

for me the entertainment in the playoffs was not very good..

with all the hype all year...

and last year..

and they choke...

boo boo hoo!!!!

feel sorry for the season ticket holders...

they expected more....!!!!

pageC4
CTB MVP X1
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Repped High Quality Post

The problem with blaming the refs

I think many Clippers fans had high hopes for the 2014 post season. While we are all happy to have a team in playoff contention many of us were disappointed by another second round exit. After this ouster a thread was created: Clippers vs Thunder 2014 - What Went Wrong?

In this thread members posted their opinions on the ultimate cause of the Clippers 2014 postseason failure. One of the more popular beliefs in this thread is that "the refs sealed our fate with their one way calling." While calls were a factor in this series it was not the underlying cause. There were many games where the Clippers opened up a lead against the Thunder, only to see the leads dwindle and result in a Thunder rally.

Ultimately this series exposed many problems the Clippers have as a collective group. Above all we revealed that we can build a lead on one of the best teams. We addressed the shooting deficiencies of last year, but on the other hand we exposed a glaring weakness on the defensive end. As easily as we can build a leadwe can lose it.

As I observe the teams in the final four they carry a composition that we simply do not have. One person here refers to this as "3-D." The ability to shoot well beyond the perimeter and also to play great defense. While we have the 3 part down, we are sorely lacking the defense to compete against the leagues elite.

We don't have defensive specialists like Serge Ibaka, Shane Battier, Lance Stephenson, or many other ancillary players on the Spurs squad. This, I believe, is what we are missing on our squad.

This leads me to my next point. We have glaring deficiencies to address on this squad, and we have to identify and acknowledge this that way we can make changes and go further in the playoffs. Blaming refs is a dangerous thing to do. Why? Because the assumption in doing so is that this team is complete as is, and can win a title given "the refs" don't screw it up. We all know that isn't the case. Even during the regular season we struggled against the leagues elite, and our lack of defense was to blame, not officials. The series against the Thunder was decided in six games, we didn't even go a full seven games against. To me that is a very telling development.

My hope is that our FO makes some changes, and bring in some defense because we are an incomplete team. I do not for one minute believe that even if we had better calls we would have won against the Thunder. Hell, let's be honest the Warriors, without Bogut, took us to 7 games. This was no coincidence. We are, in the end, an unfinished product. And until we address defensive shortcomings we will not be able to advance.

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