The 2014-15 Clippers Are Going in the Right Direction (P. 2)

Clippers TopBuzz Forum/Message Board » Clippers News & General Discussions
Post new topic   Reply to topic
Author Search This Topic:
 
tense2
CTB MVP X2
Posts: 8865
votes: 20

Don't think anyone screw anyone really. They both took the best offers.

clipper*joe
CTB MVP Champion
Posts: 15920
Location: los angeles
calif.gif
votes: 125

Actually, you're right. I read your previous post and it comes down to who allowed the mess to begin with. But the plan was to for Parson to wait. He decided not to. But either way, they wanted to move Lin and Asik. They just lost their cap space for gambling.

clipper*joe
CTB MVP Champion
Posts: 15920
Location: los angeles
calif.gif
votes: 125

Again, Parson's was supposed to wait and he would have been taken care of. He decided not to and that put Houston on the clock.

CapsNClips
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 4033

us.gif
votes: 45

That's true, Parsons set a ticking bomb on his own franchise.

Rockets fans are probably not too happy with Chandler now.

uncool
Clipper Starter
 Avatar
Posts: 907
votes: 5

I've been wanting to point this out all day! Sometimes keeping your team together with an addition or 2 is a lot better than trying to get cute like Morey and gambling so much! If Ariza goes back to "I'm paid already so why play hard before my contract year"-Ariza, then all those "genius poison-pill contracts" that stole Lin & Asik plus a 1st rd pick plus Chandler Parsons who will be better than Ariza & could have been on his rookie deal 1 more year, all got moved for an average Ariza...

I'll take Doc's savvy over that nerd Morey any day.

tense2
CTB MVP X2
Posts: 8865
votes: 20

The hardships of RFA. He had no guarantee that the Rockets wanted to match. Rockets flinched first.

clipper*joe
CTB MVP Champion
Posts: 15920
Location: los angeles
calif.gif
votes: 125

There was a article posted on realgm where Morrey declined the qualifying offer in order to free cap space to land another player. It said it was just a formality since Parson's was going to be taken care of. I'm sure Parsons knew and was on board, until Cuban came in with a offer he couldn't refuse.

Agent0
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 4240
votes: 41

Seems like most are more upset with Morey. In the end l Morey has a plan and he's sticking to it, so at least we can commend him for that. He's consistently said that he wants to get a third star level player and he doesn't believe Parsons is at that level, so he's going to keep holding out until he can get that type of player.

Honestly, does anyone think that team with Parsons is a championship contender? They match that contract and they lock themselves into that core for another 3 seasons at least. TS really not so bad, and Parsons gets his money and stays in Texas too, so he can't be displeased either. Mavs fans love it.

clipper*joe
CTB MVP Champion
Posts: 15920
Location: los angeles
calif.gif
votes: 125

There was a article posted on realgm where Morey declined the qualifying offer in order to free cap space to land another player. It said it was just a formality since Parson's was going to be taken care of. I'm sure Parsons knew and was on board, until Cuban came in with a offer he couldn't refuse. I'm pretty sure Parson's was on board being that Morey could have easily taken the qualifying offer and made him play for peanuts.

uncool
Clipper Starter
 Avatar
Posts: 907
votes: 5

I get that, but I blame Morey for taking the risk based on the assumption that LeBron or Melo or Bosh would just jump at the chance to take less guaranteed money to play with Harden & Dwight. I think he has a skewed view of his team, how good they are and the destination that Houston is. The stars aligned with Dwight hating LAL & Kobe, but Brons & Melos aren't dreaming of humid Houston. It was a gamble based on miscalculations and arrogance.

ADDED BONUS-

Parsons and Lin were tight with Dwight last season. Changes Rockets' chemistry aside from obvious basketball losses.

  • KEVIN DING (@KevinDing)
tense2
CTB MVP X2
Posts: 8865
votes: 20

Morley gambled and "lost". I don't blame Parsons, it's a business.

JQuick32
CTB MVP X1
 Avatar
Posts: 3128
votes: 10

Problem is, that third star doesn't seem to want to go to Houston for many reasons: Morey is a jerk who treats his players like assets instead of human beings, McHale is the worst coach in the league, Harden is a no-defense chucker, etc. At what point do Howard and Harden get tired of a team that's always chasing the next superstar and never winning anything in the here and now?

They've also most likely pissed off Dwight now by letting Parsons walk. Dwight can opt out in two years and at this point goes through teams like used toilet paper, so the Rockets are in trouble.

Agent0
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 4240
votes: 41

Yup he's being greedy and just keeps tossing players around and is keeping a coach that can't maximize his talent. He should instead try to build around the two guys he now has with players that compliment them. I will say that Ariza who is a better defender than Parsons at $8M is a good pickup for them. Not sure Parsons is worth twice as much as Ariza, but he might continue to develop and could be, we'll see. If that happens, well then he'll be kicking himself.

Washington fans were wondering why Ariza wouldn't sign with them if he just wanted $8M. Some people suggested that maybe he wanted more money from Washington because the tax is higher there than in Texas.

CP3Heliflopter
CTB MVP X2
 Avatar
Posts: 6008
votes: 10

Parsons is a mediocre defender at best. Ariza last season was frankly the better player due to his defense.

Parsons did the right thing by accepting that huge offer. He would be a moron not to. Morey doesn't give a dam about "taking care of players". They are all assets in his mind which isn't necessarily a bad thing.

So many teams overpaying for SFs. Parsons and Hayward are 8-10m guys tops. Really sad. Frankly this didn't backfire much if at all for the Rockets. Parsons isn't as good as people think he is.

uncool
Clipper Starter
Posts: 907
votes: 5

Interesting article comparing Daryl Morey to Chris Paul...

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/the-b ... ryl-morey/

clipper*joe
CTB MVP Champion
Posts: 15920
Location: los angeles
calif.gif
votes: 125

Great read. I know they call Morey "dork elvis" (coined by Simmons). But why? Does anyone know?

Dunkathon
Clipper All-Star
Posts: 1079
votes: 8


Repped High Quality Post

Simmons coined the term "Dork Elvis" to compare the worship stat nerds heap upon Morey to how girls heaped worship upon Elvis.

Plus, his face looks a little bit like Elvis shortly before his death.

clipper*joe
CTB MVP Champion
Posts: 15920
Location: los angeles
calif.gif
votes: 125

Thank you! Quite a good explanation. That deserves a rep. I often wondered why he used the Elvis reference.

Clipperman#5
Clipper Starter
Posts: 278
Location: Los Angeles, CA.
votes: 1

Only problem I have is that going into draft if they knew they were gonna loose out on Collison why not draft a PG I'm seeing some pretty good PGs who were drafted after Wilcox who are doing pretty good in both summer leagues or is that just me???

Diamond909
Clipper Starter
Posts: 405
Location: Clipper Nation
votes: 0

http://www.veooz.com/photos/RGv~NSu.htmlhttp:// http://www.veooz.com/photos/RGv~NSu.html

To say, if Dudley was healthy we as a team would of made it to the finals at least. His scoring would of took the focus off cp3 and blake. Dj just disappeared so, I was a Lil frustrating! I need to calm down lol so, good post dude. I hope in the near future that we can be like the spurs, no matter who gets hurt someone's always there to step up!

Diamond909
Clipper Starter
Posts: 405
Location: Clipper Nation
votes: 0

For any that missed it

Watch "NBA Summer League: Doc Rivers Postgame - 7/14/14" on YouTube

NBA Summer League: Doc Rivers Postgame - 7/14/14:

ClipperKyle32
CTB MVP X1
 Avatar
Posts: 3237
votes: 27
Right Now We Are Better Than We Were Last Year. I mean look guys. Spencer Hawes is A DYNAMIC BIG for us. Hedo Turkoglu Ryan Hollins Byron Mullens Antawn Jamison Brandon Davies Glen Davis Lou Amundson Stephen Jackson These were our entire bigs from....

Please log in to view the entire post.

Agent0
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 4240
votes: 41

I don't know if there were any rookie PG's in the draft that would actually be able to give any sort of solid and consistent production for a high level team in their first year. Even the good rookie PG's struggle. PG is a harder position to put a non-experienced player, while as a shooter SG, the player doesn't need to know how to run a team or limit turnovers or handle ball pressure. If we drafted a PG, we'd still go out and sign a PG.

Docs interview he basically inferred that they weren't planning on re-signing Collison because they knew he was out of their price range, and that's okay. Darren got more money and a starting spot, and we just couldn't justify using our MLE on Darren over a big man that could potentially play 27-30 MPG off the bench and compliments both our bigs as well as our PG, that just wouldn't be good use of money.

The right decision was made. Was Farmar the right decision? Well so far only Steve Blake as a PG has accepted as little money as him, and I'd take him over Blake, so the options are only so much. I think Brian Roberts might have gotten more money even

ClipperKyle32
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 3237
votes: 27

I am so sorry , but this comedian , a Laker fan I might add , called Jim Buss - Short Buss lol in reference to his mental capacity for running an NBA franchise. That cracks me up haha

da11da
Clipper 6th Man
Posts: 215
votes: 0

The right direction? Can someone explain this please. We drafter another sg who probably can't play like our last years pick. We downgraded from Collison to Farmar, we werent able to bring in Deng, Ariza or Pierce and to top it off our Coach is blaming our racist owner for his own shortcomings. We signed Hawes which was great but other than that how can can anyone say we're headed in the right direction.

CapsNClips
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 4033

us.gif
votes: 45

I know, we should've signed Collison with our MLE and then with our other MLE we should've signed Deng and then that would've left us with our 3rd MLE to use on Hawes and our BAE on Lance Stephenson.

And then with our remaining vet minimums I was thinking we should've signed Josh McRoberts and Paul Pierce.

da11da
Clipper 6th Man
Posts: 215
votes: 0

Well you have succeeded in proving you are a smart ass but my question wasn't why didn't we sign these players. I wanted someone to elaborate on how we are headed in the right direction.

CapsNClips
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 4033

us.gif
votes: 45

Um..idk maybe because we fixed our biggest weakness last season which was our backup bigs by getting the best backup big man available.

We also got a really nice backup PG for less than half the price of Collison.

Our team got better compared to our team last year.

Better = Good

Good = Positive

Positive = Right direction.

Does that help?

da11da
Clipper 6th Man
Posts: 215
votes: 0

So a decent backup big and a nice & cheap backuo pg is a step in the right direction. Got it. We'll just ignore the negatives and be happy. Thanks BRO.

ClipperPostman
Clipper All-Star
Posts: 1321
votes: 18

Great question. We are headed in the right direction because we aren't making a bunch of high profile stupid moves trying to "Shake things up" because a bunch of fans who have no clue about what building a championship team over-time means.

We were already the 3rd best team in the west and possibly the league. A few tough calls/made shots/clutched balls away from the WCF. We don't need to make any "huge" moves. We just need to plug 2 holes so we can get past OKC/Spurs. We are not "rebuilding" a team.

  1. We kept all the key pieces from last year together. We have already plugged our biggest hole from last season, which was a 3rd big. Big Baby playing back up C was a disaster. That hole was filled beautifully.

  2. The important pieces of our team from last year are still together. So they have chemistry and one more year in this system will prove much better.

  3. No sterling fiasco/distraction this playoffs will def help.

  4. All we need is a Decent defensive SF who can slow KD/Leonard down. Ariza and Deng would have been nice, but they are not needed. Someone with a strong body and lateral quickness... and some height will do.

  5. There is an entire offseason left to pick up an SF, so being patient is a quality I like in Doc and the clippers staff.

That's why we are going in the right direction.

cleepers
CTB MVP X2
Posts: 8917

us.gif
votes: 112

It's like if you're sitting there in your undershirt, boxers and socks with nothing else to wear. You need pants, a shirt and shoes before you can go out anywhere nice, but you only have enough money for one of them.

If you buy yourself a pair of pants, you are undoubtedly "headed in the right direction".

Hope that clears things up for you.

Yellow_Flash_Colorz_PDT_06

CapsNClips
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 4033

us.gif
votes: 45

Decent backup big??? Who's a better backup big in the NBA right now? If he's not THE best, he's damn near close.

And what negatives are you talking about? Not signing a star SF for the MLE? That was never gonna happen.

A negative is a subtraction. What have we subtracted from this team that we haven't gained back?

da11da
Clipper 6th Man
Posts: 215
votes: 0

I see your point, i just feel like we downgraded on backup pg and upgraded at backup c. Didn't add a sf (yet) and we havent drafted very well the last two years. In my opinion a step in the right direction would be to a hire a gm.

CapsNClips- You are clearly just trying to argue with me. I'm not here for that.

CapsNClips
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 4033

us.gif
votes: 45

To upgrade our backup C, we had to "downgrade" our backup PG.

And who would you have taken after Reggie Bullock in the 2013 Draft that would've been so much better?

CJ Wilcox is insurance for if/when Jamal is gone. He's also an "upgrade" over Willie.

I'm sorry if I continue to argue with you, but you're making it very difficult on me to do anything other than that.

cleepers
CTB MVP X2
 Avatar
Posts: 8917

us.gif
votes: 112

Farmar was probably the best available for what we had to spend. We would have had to use our MLE to retain Collison or get Livingston, which would have meant we literally stood still. Hawes will likely be much more of an upgrade backing up both our bigs for 25+ minutes per game he'll see than Farmar being a downgrade for the 15 minutes or so he'll play.

I'm not really thrilled with our last couple of draft picks either, but more often than not mid-20's picks will turn out to be journeymen at best. We still don't know how either of them will turn out later on (although I'm not very high on Bullock), but there's no formula for picking up rough diamonds who turn out to be superstars. Even the Spurs - who seem to be excellent drafters - usually have to wait for their guys to grow.

As for getting a GM... that's the new owner's call. There's no way that the NBA or Parsons are going to risk alienating or even losing Doc - who put on the best possible face for the franchise and the league throughout the whole Sterling mess - by handing over a large part of his power to some stranger who may well have to be paid to go away once Ballmer takes over anyway. Particularly when Doc assembled the third best team in the league last year.

It is what it is. A new owner may choose to make big, sweeping changes or he may choose to do what we're doing right now... getting incrementally better with every realistic opportunity.

pageC4
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 4694

us.gif
votes: 24

Spencer Hawes is a good backup big to have. He appears to be the stretch 4/5 we were hoping Byron Mullens would be. I like Spencer Hawes as a player, but even good players need to have the right supporting cast to make things work as a team. Clearly the best players to get are players that are "two way" players, which means they play offense and defense. If they don't play one side of the ball then the guys that play with them better make up for that deficiency.

Outside of Deandre Jordan and Chris Paul this squad really doesn't have good defensive players, and that's what worries me about the Hawes addition. Hawes doesn't have the reputation of being a defensive minded big, say like Ed Davis or Reggie Evans. This is more along the lines of what we need to balance out a roster heavy in offensive minded players like Blake Griffin, J.J. Redick, Jamal Crawford, Jared Dudley, and Jordan Farmar.

It's almost equivalent to the Memphis Grizzlies adding yet another defensive minded player when their deficiency is the offensive side. I'm not trying to be Debbie Downer on these acquisitions, but it almost seems as if Hawes will essentially be replacing the offensive contributions that Collison was providing.

What can be said of this offseason is that Doc has done an amazing job of replacing players that left during a very bad time for us. I think he has probably done as good a job as can be expected given our cap situation and ownership troubles, but I just don't think Hawes and Farmar make us better than last year. What I think these guys will do is allow us to keep that standing, 3rd in the west.

jazclipcity3
Clipper Rookie
Posts: 53
votes: 0

^^^^^^ Hawes has shown glimpses of good defense in the past and has never played for a defensive minded coach like doc before. I feel like it was a great pick up, it's always nice to have a stretch 4/5 on your squad. Luckily we play a lot of team defense, rotating and such. So he should be able to get it this off-season. As far as farmar goes. ... the man can shoot, plus he's a good passer and does very well in the pick and roll setting.

pageC4
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 4694

us.gif
votes: 24

Kyle posted a very good youtube mix of Hawes. It showed some good promise. What he appears to do is simply throw that big body onto opposing players and that height just towers over everyone and makes it difficult to shoot over.

He's not a negative on the defensive end don't get me wrong. I just think it's more his physical attribute that helps him not so much great coverage or blocks. Doc will help him for sure, but just as last year showed there's only so much Doc can do. Hell with a squad of Dudley, Griffin, Redick, Paul, and Jordan I was sure that all we needed was simply a defensive minded coach to emphasize that side of the ball. Sadly, that isn't enough... a coach can only do so much. As for defense as a team there were some positive areas of improvement that we saw, such as better 3 point defense. we went from one of the worst in the league to the best if I'm not mistaken. But again I think if you want to contend you need to have balance, and the scales are tipped on the offensive side of the ball when it comes to this team. Hence my hesitancy to call the Hawes acquisition being in a better position than last year, especially when you consider that we lost Granger, and Collison.

CapsNClips
CTB MVP X1
 Avatar
Posts: 4033

us.gif
votes: 45

I totally get what you are saying about wanting another post defender and I'm not gonna lie and say Hawes is that, but he's also not a liability on the defensive end and that's what we desperatly needed. Big Baby was a huge liability on defense when he was playing C because he was too small to guard the 7 footers.

Our front line last year would get absolutely exposed whenever DJ went out and it caused teams to focus their attention onto getting buckets in the paint.

We are an amazing perimeter defending team and if teams are taking it to the hoop every time it doesn't allow us to use our strengths on defense.

Hawes is just good enough on defense that teams won't alter their gameplan when DJ goes out. Also if we get Big Baby back he's a better defender when he's guarding PF's.

pageC4
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 4694

us.gif
votes: 24

Yeah, that is the positive about this signing. Hawes is not the defensive liability that Mullens or the other backup bigs have been. Big Baby has never been a great defender it's simply his size that helps him. With that wide frame he "clogs" rather than "defends." Also, you're correct that he is too small to guard natural bigs.

The added post defender is incredibly crucial for the very reasons you stated. One of DJ's faults is that he can get in foul trouble really easy, and when this happens the defense takes a huge hit.

We still have some time to acquire a defensive player, and about the best thing that can happen for us right now is for Dudley to come back to his Phoenix form this year so that we can trade him for one.

ClipperRevival
Clipper 6th Man
Posts: 173
votes: 0

This team is oh so close. What is clearly missing is a very good wing defender. There are just so many great wing players, we need someone to keep these guys in check. We have more than enough offense, we need defense.

BaadMaster
Clipper Starter
Posts: 513
Location: Los Angeles
votes: 5

I have to disagree here. I think Matt Barnes could be the defensive-minded starter on a Championship team. Every team needs an "enforcer," and Matt is that. An ex-football player too. If he gets a bit more selective on his shots, he is perfect for this high-powered team. And a backup to Barnes could easily be picked up mid-season. Granger was pretty awful, so no loss there.

With the addition of Hawes and Farmar, and the re-signing of Big Baby, we are very close to a title team.

All we need is health, a little luck, the final exile of DTS and some fair reffing and we are all set!

I go to Vegas in August; hoping to get some good odds on the Clips to win it all!!!

ClipperRevival
Clipper 6th Man
 Avatar
Posts: 173
votes: 0

Barnes really has trouble against top 3s. He's solid but I would prefer a real stopper. We had to use a variety of different players on Durant cause he simply couldn't keep Durant in front of him. He's a super back up and an avg starter. I still like him though and hope he proves me wrong. He's a solid athlete but lacks the foot speed to keep elite 3s in front of him.

renshaibob
Clipper Starter
Posts: 967
votes: 1

I like Barnes as a bench player. His energy lvl is hard to match and he always brings it even if were losing.

kjavis
Clipper All-Star
Posts: 1075
votes: 3

We all do, except there is no one else capable of starting, Bullock is still raw and Duds is just one big dud

SamMays
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 4036
votes: 54

There is no doubt that we are better than last year.

SF) Dudley was traded for to be a starter. He came in out of shape and didn't shoot it as well as he needs to. That can be remedied this year and I suspect he will do the job. Barnes is Barnes, a good backup SF pressed into a starting assignment. Bullock may also improve from last year. Quite often seasons 1 to 2 and/or seasons 2 to 3 are where players really step up. Hopefully Bullock will do just that. If he does, we could have our SF problems solved. If not, I think we will be slightly better at the position than last year.

SG) If JJ stays healthy, that position will be improved from last year.

C) DJ is getting better every year.

PF and PG) We have two of the best players in the league at those positions and we can expect great play from both of them.

Backup Center) Hawes is a huge improvement from what we had last year.

Backup PG) I think we got a very different player than Collison, but a player who might be a better fit in this system in Farmar.

Add to that, increased chemistry to a team that was just a couple plays from going to the conference finals We're in great shape. If we have good health, expect a 3 to 7 game win improvement and a better playoff team.

renshaibob
Clipper Starter
Posts: 967
votes: 1

What is Clippers Basketball? are we more Princeton, Triangle, Pick&Roll or Iso Team. Are we a banging gritty team or a finesse team?

ClipperPostman
Clipper All-Star
Posts: 1321
votes: 18

What player on planet earth aside from Tony Allen can contain Durant?

Clipperfn4lf
Clipper All-Star
Posts: 1465
votes: 11

Yah, Hawes was a key pickup. However, Big Baby acts like a real b**** would have been cool to get Craig Smith back to bully bigs around.

JQuick32
CTB MVP X1
 Avatar
Posts: 3128
votes: 10

I think Doc is trying to emulate the Spurs' identity... motion offense with unselfish ball movement, team defense. I know just about every team pays lip service to the Spurs' model but we actually aren't that far off.

Go To the Top of the ThreadGo Home

or Comment Using FB

Post new topic   Reply to topic


← The Top 50 Players in Clippers History

→ Ralph Lawler's Future

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

register
You are an anonymous user- Register now!


Follow our Los Angeles Clippers RSS Feed, plus the Clippers Rumors RSS Feed, the LA Clippers News RSS feed, and the Clippers Forum RSS feed to get the newest updated Clippers News and Trade Rumors plus Clippers Game update in your RSS/XML reader!