Should the Clippers Resign DeAndre Jordan to a New Contract? (P. 3)

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ClipperPostman
Clipper All-Star
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This isn't even a debate, Marc Gasol is a Defensive beast. Just watch the tapes. During this season he was recovering from an MCL Sprain so he wasn't himself much of the season. Even still the team was FAR better with Gasol back then without.

Did you watch that OKC Series? Gasol dominated the paint defensively, which is why they went to 7 games in the first place. His Offensive game took a huge dive in the PO though. But defensively he is top 3 C's when healthy.

Memphis would have beat OKC in 5 games if they still had Rudy Gay, and used him to come off the bench and score, then sit him back on the bench before he shoots the team out of the game.

The only reason they lost is because they just couldn't score at long stretches during the game.

clipfan63
Clipper Rookie
Posts: 56
votes: 0

Not hardley,Jordan's pitiful performance that year was due to an inept coach with a weak coaching philosophy and poor strategies.Marc's play suffered no doubt due to injuries,which might be resolved and they might might not,This season will tell.At age 29 he's not old,but by NBA standards he's not a youngster either.Some players can play till they're 40 others are washed up before 35.Last season Marc pulled a Kobe,got injured returned and got injured again almost immediately.At this point there are definitely questions as to whether he can stay healthy for a long stretch.

Junkyarddog
Clipper D-League Pickup
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I think we should look to improve our starting Sg and SF positions before anything. Having Spencer Hawes has taken away a lot of Dj's Leverage on a new deal. Which is great for us. Dj would be great in the 10-13 million per year range. Anything above that I wouldn't do unless we happen to get some diamond in the rough Sg or Sf starter. Dj is 7ft and athletic. That Is about it. He really doesn't bring much more to the table from a skills standpoint. His rebounding and blocks are great, but he lacks serious fundamentals. I hate when he gets out rebounded by someone like kevin love or zbo because he doesn't box out. Its not like he's some rebounding machine. He pretty much just gets the ones that fall to him, but if someone is battling him he usually gives up the board. When he goes up against any decent center he almost allways gets outplayed. His hands are horrible, he has no moves, can't shoot free throws, is a horrible passer, and gets stripped by small defenders way too much. I know our perimeter defense needs work, but Dj doesn't seem to be in the right places at the right times and it costs him lots of fouls. Theres too many times he doesn't even rotate giving up to many layups. He needs to learn to just move his feet and be in position instead of being a shot blocking Hero. Theres a reason he doesn't get plays called for him. With his size and athleticism theres no reason he couldn't be the best center in the league. I'm not sure he will improve much more. I hope he does because 7ft amazing athletes don't grow on trees. So basically keep Dj if his contact is reasonable. He better improve a ton if we are going to give him around 15+. Marc Gasol deserves the Max. Marc makes Dj look like a High School player out there when he schools him from all aspects of basketball except for dunking.

The big elephant in the room is out need for length and size at the 2 and 3. With out max players being CP and Blake we need to understand they are undersized and its asking too much of them to be lockdown defenders because they are shorter then most of the guys they guard. We need guys like Sefalosha, Ariza, afflalo to help make up for the short arms of cp and blake. If we are going to win a chip in this window we are going to have to go through Durant and Lebron for the next couple years. We should probably spend the money we are going to pay Dj on a two way Sg or preferably Sf. I think Redick should stay, but move to the bench and we trade Jamal and Dj for something if possible. JJ would be great for our bench and he could play with the starters when we play small ball.

In doc we trust and we will see what moves we can make, but we can't make moves just to make moves. We are only going as far a Blake takes us. He's the only guy that i think has the chance to be an unstoppable player with a little improvement. He's the guy the league fears will get any better. If he gets that jumpshot down and Blake stops taking a back seat to chris, WATCHOUT.

BTW F@CK Demarcus Cousins for hurting JJ last year. If no moves are made this year. All we can ask for is that everyone is healthy down the stretch heading into the playoffs. Its not like we have a bad team. We just need guys to grow this season.

clipfan63
Clipper Rookie
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votes: 0

What a ridiculous statement, did you fall of the planet last season.Here's a news flash Jordan was the #1 rebounder in the entire league last year.Maybe I'm a little slow so please explain how a player can get out rebounded by everybody but end up with the most rebounds in the entire league.Nobody has ever led the league in rebounding by "just getting the ones that fall to them."

botev1921
Clipper Starter
Posts: 537

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Ask yourselves this - how many teams won championships BECAUSE they had great centers since Shaq and the Lakers? Centers DO NOT WIN titles nowadays and you need players who are not just very good at one thing but are not terrible at anything and the guy is a liability in more than one aspect of the game!

ClipperPostman
Clipper All-Star
Posts: 1374
votes: 18

Your post doesn't make any sense bro... Here's why

  1. How many teams won great because they had great centers? The spurs.

But I see the argument you are trying to make. That doesn't mean having a solid center is irrelevant. Multiple superstars is needed to win championships in the nba. Whether that superstar is a center, pf, and/or sf.

The better question is how many teams have needed a solid defensive/rebounding center matched with a scoring Pf in order to win the chip since shaq?

Ummm let's see -

Lakers - gasol/Bynum

Celtics - Garnett/Perkins

Mavs - dirk/chandler

Spurs - Duncan/splitter

If you look at the years Miami won the chip they put a defensive minded center next to bosh. And if you look at the 2 years they loss, who did they lose to? Teams with scoring pf/ defensive center.

This is why I'm for keeping Dj and so is doc, because he obviously know how important a solid defensive c is to a championship.

Blake/Dj great combo for a championship team.

The other part of your post is just completely false. Role players ARE really good at one thing and generally terrible at others. That's why they are role players.

MunoValente
Clipper Starter
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Did you miss this year's playoffs? Duncan plays the large majority of his minutes center now and the rest go to Splitter who is also very good.

So maybe the Heat didn't have one, but Tyson Chandler has been an all-star, Pau Gasol mostly played center for the Lakers because of Bynum's health and was of course one of their stars. Ben Wallace was an all-star. Garnett and younger Duncan both the length and shot challenging ability of centers even if they didn't play there as much as they do now, so in a way their teams were basically using two centers on defense. Even guys like Odom, Bosh and Rasheed Wallace had the legit length needed to be a primary help defenders; Griffin does not, so we need someone next to him that does.

Maybe you could say the center role has changed some, so that softer, more mobile players can work there, but they still need to be long enough to challenge shots in the paint.

Agent0
CTB MVP X1
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It's the defense, you're just thinking of offense. This team wouldn't be able to maximize itself without a player like DJ because Blake does not have length and is not a rim protector. Has nothing to do with having a great C and all to do with having players that compliment each other, not just on offense, but also defense.

Basically what the other people have said. Also like MunoValente said, people tend to forget that technically the Spurs have a great C because they play Duncan at C a good amount and he has the size, length and ability to play the C role both on offense and defense, but that is an aside.

If we can't keep DJ, okay, but we still have to fill that role, we can't just say "oh we can't keep DJ so we won't have a defensive C on the roster". That's exactly what would be necessary to NOT go far as a team.

With C and SF, we have two options:

1) Re-sign DJ and get a MLE level SF (if we aren't in luxury where we only have the mini-mid level) or improve SF via trade

2) Get a higher paid SF and find another MLE type C to pair with Blake and Hawes

DJ has the chemistry and has been here and knows the system, so the first option is bring back DJ and upgrade SF with a trade of MLE. So unless it just isn't realistic financially to bring back DJ (don't want to give the max and someone else does), that is by far the first option. If it isn't financially feasible, then okay, we put more money into SF and look to sign someone like Biyombo or Mozgov or something as the defense/rebounding C.

Let's look at it with the roster. We will have these players under contract if everyone picks up their options:

(PG) Chris Paul / Jordan Farmar (SG) J.J. Redick / Reggie Bullock / CJ Wilcox (SF) Jared Dudley (PF) Blake Griffin (C) Spencer Hawes

That will be $60.5M in salary. The salary cap this season is $63M, so let's just say it is anywhere from $64-65M for 15-16. So we would be about $3.5-4.5M under the cap. We will also have these two contracts that are team options:

Jamal Crawford ($5.67M - guaranteed $1.5M) and Matt Barnes ($3.54M, fully non-guaranteed)

If we decline both options, which really looks like a waste because at the least if you don't want to bring them back, you can use those guys in trades, but we would still have to pay Jamal $1.5M and the team would have just $2-3M in cap space. If in addition, Dudley is traded for a second round pick to clear space or doesn't pick up his option, we would have $6.25-7.25M in cap space and 7 players on the roster. You can't get a SF that is the same impact player or caliber of DJ for that kind of money.

Even then, who are the free agent SF's:

Jeff Green ($9.2M player option)

Thaddeus Young ($9.7M player option)

Rudy Gay

Wilson Chandler ($7.2M team option)

Draymond Green

Carlos Delfino ($3.3M team option)

The bottom three are the only ones you can get with that amount of money and really you don't need to be clearing space for Green or Delfino as part MLE will get you there. Also remember that if you did use the money for a SF, now you need to get a C with the MLE. So what are your options:

Bismack Biyombo (RFA)

Anderson Varejao

Tyson Chandler

Roy Hibbert ($15.5M player option)

Ian Mahinmi

Marc Gasol

Kosta Koufos

Omer Asik

Emeka Okafor

Robin Lopez

Amir Johnson (PF/C)

Enes Kanter (RFA)

1) We have to see which of those players are actually acquirable via MLE

2) The player in combination with a SF we are capable of acquiring would have to provide great overall team impact than having DJ would

Junkyarddog
Clipper D-League Pickup
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News flash DJ is not a good basketball player skills wise. He's just really tall and has long arms and jumps high. That's it. If you want to give him a max contract for that, then I'm glad your not the gm. He may have lead the league in rebounds which is great, but for what he's paid and the lack of production in all other areas that's the least he could do. I don't he has it mentally. You want to make him the big 3rd guy? Ok. What do you think CP3 does in the offseason? I'm guessing he's hating the taste of losing and is in the gym salivating waiting for his redemption. Same goes for Blake. I know we don't have to worry about Blake and CP, They obviously work on their game and have a fire inside of them that makes them great competitors. Always improving.

Your golden child Dj is hanging out SMOKING WEED with(pause) get this...

Ryan Gomes, Big freaken fat ass baby, Ryan I was one of the least productive clippers ever Gomes, and Matt Barnes(matts ok in my book because at least I know mentally he hates losing)

That snapshot should tell you everything you need to know about DJ and why he's not a max player. If he want less than 10mil then sign him up, but we are just signing a one trick pony. Who's numbers lead us to believe he's a great defender, but anyone who knows about the feel and mental part of the game not just the fantasy stats knows DJ isn't our 3rd star.

I fell on the planet yesterday and figured that out right away.

MunoValente
Clipper Starter
Posts: 426
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Couldn't you say a lot of same stuff about championship winning centers like Tyson Chandler and Ben Wallace? Being long, strong, mobile and jumping high is awfully good combination on a basketball court. Those guys were smarter on defense, but Jordan is still consistently improving there and both of those guys didn't peak until their late 20's.

BennyBeFly
Clipper 6th Man
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votes: 2

This isn't chess. Basketball is an athletic contact sport. There are many players that have a ton of skill but never make it big in the NBA simply because they weren't athletic enough. If that were the case, I know some great 6'1" Centers at my gym with great big man skills. Why don't we just sign them since they have great post moves, can shoot free throws and SKILLFULLY grab rebounds (on people their height or shorter) lol.

There is a reason why D1 college coaches of successful programs offer scholarships to 4 and 5 star athletes. Mid majors get 3 star athletes. JuCo up to D2 get 1 and 2 star athletes.

clipfan63
Clipper Rookie
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votes: 0

First off I never said anything about a max contract,but the fact remains that Jordan improved by leaps and bounds last year under Doc in the very first season and with a system that was new and unfamiliar.And by the way he didn't just lead the league in rebounds, he was also the #3 shot blocker.Is he the next Bill Russel,certainly not,but as the #1 rebounder and the#3 shot blocker at the very least he's developing into a solid rim defender.Last season only 2 players ranked higher than him in blocked shots,Davis and Ibaka both great rim protectors.And at only 25 he still has huge upside potential.If you think there are any better options available at present better look again.

sz123456
Clipper All-Star
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votes: 13

I would argue that it very much is chess in the last 6 minutes of nearly every playoff game. DJ is worth every single penny in the regular season, but from our last 3 exits from the playoffs, he has been completely taken out of his game by other centers.

We'll see what his numbers looks like this year, but if he can't get above 50% on FTs, is this even a debate? Upwards of $10 million a year for a guy that you're praying doesn't get fouled in the last 6 minutes?

This isn't Shaq who was worth being on the court despite poor foul shooting, it's DJ.

danielson
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my issue with DJ is he's headed into his 7th NBA season and still no offensive game. too many mental lapses in critical times of a game. plus i don't understand why everyone gave him a pass in the playoffs last year. when OKC and Warriors played hack a DJ, leads grew for the opposing team or our lead shrank.

ClipperPostman
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Why would Dj need an offensive game? He scores 10ppg with the highest field goal percentage in the league. Would you like it better if he scored 10 ppg on jump shots and sky hooks? That would help us win?

We need Dj to be a defensive anchor and he is going to be that this year. Last year was an entirely new system and he did very well. Of course no one wants to talk about going from playing zone defense to playing no zone whatsoever.

Dj will have another year with this system and will be even better this year than last year.

Without Dj in the game our defense went straight to hell.

Dj came up big at the end of many games last year with key blocks etc..

He also had multiple monster games. 16-17-8. Those are insane numbers and to be able to put those up at the age of 25 is spectacular.

Dj was third in DPOY voting for a reason. It was clear he was a dominant force in the paint. Unlike clippers fans who expect him never to make a mistake or miss an assignment they are more realistic.

No center in the league makes great defensive plays every possession.

clipfan63
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Well said,couldn't have said it any better than that.Finally an accurate and objective viewpoint.

SteveBaller
Clipper 6th Man
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Well said, and the most salient points made in this discussion.

Playoff basketball is won by the teams with the smartest players with the strongest fundamentals (ex. Spurs). Kendrick Perkins and Steven Adams outplayed DJ. That was fundamentals vs athleticism, small contracts vs big contract. DJ is not worth a big chunk of our cap space. Hawes averages 2 less rebounds per 36 and 0.8 less blocks over their careers. He costs half as much. And it goes without saying, Hawes' offense and fundamentals are exponentially more polished than DJ's. How many times did we see DJ miss a layup last season?

Junkyarddog
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Exactly. It is a chess game. There's a reason Kevin love is a beast on the boards at his size and lack of athletiscm. It's because he is mentally stronger than most his competition. He sees things before they happen, anticipation, positioning, reading and reacting. It's mostly mental. I think Dj is great for our team at a about 10mil max maybe 11-12 if the cap goes way up. What people are not realizing is this is a capped league so giving him such a huge percentage of the cap for what he provides is not a good idea. So Tyson helped win one chip. Great. Why would Knicks want to trade him then if he's that much important to his team. Why did Cuban get rid of him?

There's not even 4-5 centers in the league that are dominant, so unless we can get Marc gasol or Anthony Davis.. We really don't need Dj at his market rate. We need to spend our money on a SF and Sg. How much better is dJ than Reggie Evans production wise? A blocked shot per game maybe?

Reggie makes what? About 2 million?

Overpaying for size at the C is a big mistake. Besides gasol and a Davis I can't really think of a big buy that really deserves the max. By big guy I mean guys that can play center. Not Pf.

MunoValente
Clipper Starter
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Who has higher career FT%, DeAndre or Ben Wallace?

As for no offense game, he does have offensive game, he is an elite offensive rebounder, elite at the basket finisher and is very good running down the floor in transition, those things help our offense. We can also run pick and rolls with him, he sets pretty good picks these days and can be tough to handle when rolls hard to the basket. Also if we run mostly off the ball plays for him, foul shooting is less of an issue, because you don't get shots for off the ball fouls unless the other team is in the penalty. He's also such a strong finisher he can finish through his fouls a lot of the time. We don't need to run posts ups or other isolations for him, we have Griffin for that.

MunoValente
Clipper Starter
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Reggie Evan's can't effectively challenge shots at the basket, he has poor mobility defending pick and rolls and transition, and he can't effectively score even right at the basket. Jordan is way better. Evans is also old and has had health and fitness problems his entire career.

SteveBaller
Clipper 6th Man
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I'm with Junkyarddog. Reggie Evans would get even more rebounds and a couple less points for a fraction of the cost. At $10mil I'd keep DJ, but his impact in playoff basketball is far too low to justify more. His defense is criminally overrated around here. Opponents fg% at the rim is too high to consider DJ a rim protector at all. Blocks are given far too much weight when DJ often puts himself out of position to get the block, swats it out of bounds, then the other team passes it back in and scores anyway. Our lack of even decent backup bigs last season made it seem like DJ was a better defender than he actually is.

CapsNClips
CTB MVP X1
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The chances of us being able to upgrade our roster after losing DJ is minuscule.

Whether or not you think DJ is the perfect 3rd star on this team is irrelevant. We won't be able to get a Center that's better or a top tier SF to replace him.

We'd have to use our MLE on a backup big anyways so getting under the cap to sign a SF would not be worth it. We'd essentially have to waive Jamal, Dudley, Bullock, Wilcox and not re-sign Barnes or Big Baby to sign someone of quality and there isn't even that many good FA's next year.

Our only option is to re-sign DJ or trade him in a S&T. I doubt we do the second option.

ClipperPostman
Clipper All-Star
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Really kevin love gets rebounds for 2 reasons

  1. His center is a horrid rebounder so obviously loves rebounding numbers would inflate

  2. He plays no defense so he can just wait around to box out on defense.

Dj is the best rebounder in the league not only because is his athleticism and height. Anyone who thinks that hasn't followed much basketball.

For one the over the back rule pretty much cripples the idea that just because you are tall and athletic u will grab rebounds. You have to be in position or u get a foul.

Many things being said about Dj in here just are not accurate, and definitely getting rid of him could cripple the entire team defensively, energetically, and chemistry wise

SteveBaller
Clipper 6th Man
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I think the best case scenario would be a sign-and-trade if DJ wants much more than $10mil. None of the available free agent SF's next summer are worth DJ player for player. Hopefully we can keep him at a good price, but if not, luck will play into us finding a good s&t of DJ plus Jamal/Barnes/Dudley for a solid upgrade at sf plus an MLE level defensive C. Hopefully Dudley plays like he did in Phoenix this season and DJ will continue to show improvement before we sign him for around $10mil next summer....I'm optimistic about both actually.

CapsNClips
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DJ won't sign for $10mil a year, and he shouldn't. He's easily worth $12-$15mil and will probably gets offers from other teams exceeding that.

Why should DJ take a paycut after just having a career year? Makes no sense.

SteveBaller
Clipper 6th Man
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I am of the opinion that DJ is finally just now playing up to his present contract but not exceeding it. It was overly generous up until last year. As always, the market dictates a player's value, but I wouldn't be surprised if DJ is willing to help the Clippers out in order to stay in LA. This year's free agency was crazy in terms of a lot of the contracts given out. I think a majority of players and teams realize this and won't always be expecting ridiculous contracts for one dimensional players. In a year when Gordan Hayward is looking for max money, the market is obviously unstable and should inevitably right itself.

CapsNClips
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DJ is just now hitting the first stages of his prime. You don't pay a player entering his prime on his past history, you pay him for his ceiling years. DJ will hit his ceiling at some point in his next contract and $10mil ain't gonna cut it.

And the difference of DJ taking $10mil a year as opposed to $14mil doesn't make a difference to the fact that we will be a tax paying team regardless. Just because DJ signs for $10mil doesn't mean we get an extra $4mil to spend.

DJ can help the Clippers out by re-signing. No need for him to take a HUGE paycut for no reason at all.

SteveBaller
Clipper 6th Man
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Repped High Quality Post

I didn't realize we would be into the tax if we resigned DJ for close to what he is presently making.....If it doesn't make a difference regarding the cap and we feel good about our sf rotation, then sure, pay him max for all I care lol

Agent0
CTB MVP X1
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danielson wrote:
my issue with DJ is he's headed into his 7th NBA season and still no offensive game. too many mental lapses in critical times of a game. plus i don't understand why everyone gave him a pass in the playoffs last year. when OKC and Warriors played hack a DJ, leads grew for the opposing team or our lead shrank.
His offensive game actually was vastly improved in 12-13, he averaged a career high 13.0 pts/36 (10.7 pts/36 this past season). Doc came and basically said "we have enough offense, we don't need you to be a scorer, just rebound, defend and you'll score from put-backs, transition and others creating for you".

So I don't know what you want him to do with that. Also we have Hawes now.

SteveBaller wrote:
Well said, and the most salient points made in this discussion.

Playoff basketball is won by the teams with the smartest players with the strongest fundamentals (ex. Spurs). Kendrick Perkins and Steven Adams outplayed DJ. That was fundamentals vs athleticism, small contracts vs big contract. DJ is not worth a big chunk of our cap space. Hawes averages 2 less rebounds per 36 and 0.8 less blocks over their careers. He costs half as much. And it goes without saying, Hawes' offense and fundamentals are exponentially more polished than DJ's. How many times did we see DJ miss a layup last season?

2 less rebounds per 36 is actually a lot. The price is a good point, but with Hawes we would still need another C whose specialty is defense and rebounding to compliment the team.

Spurs have smarts, strong fundamentals, AND skill and size and athletic ability. The recent years Spurs went from being a team struggling to get over the hump to a higher level contender when they added length, youth and athletic ability (Danny Green, Kawhi Leonard, Tiago Splitter). Two wings who are long and athletic for their positions and a nice young C. This is the highest level, smarts and fundamentals aren't good enough because you'll have players with smarts, fundamentals, skill, and all the physical attributes too.

Agent0
CTB MVP X1
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The fact that the team is capped actually gives the opposite argument. Since we are capped, we can't sign any player the caliber of DJ because we won't be able to get far enough under the salary cap to do so. Since we are capped, keeping our players is a pretty good option. Now we are fighting against something, and that is the luxury tax, and we also don't want to get into repeater tax territory because that actually becomes debilitating. The first issue obviously becomes the fact that you only get the mini-MLE.

So yes, because of that, I see arguments financially, which is why I said if it doesn't make sense financially, but also have to take into account that the salary cap is projected to go up another $10M or so after the NBA tv deal, so that changes things too.

That said, we won't have money to spend necessarily. Without DJ we'd have about $6-7M in cap space and then the MLE to spend, and that is after declining the options of Jamal and Barnes and trading Dudley for cap space. So we would have no SF (outside of Reggie), and Reggie and CJ would be the only other backup SG's. We would have 7 players and 5 positions to fill (starting SF, another C, another back up wing) with $6-7M of cap space and the MLE.

BaadMaster
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Of course, you pay him whatever it takes. REAL centers are rare in this League. And if Ballmer can make the Commish get rid of the "Hack-A-Shaq rule, making it that a player MUST have the ball in his hands for a foul to be called, then his value increases exponentially. Either that, or learn to hit free throws.

Agent0
CTB MVP X1
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I doubt this happens, but players should be able to make FT's at this stage. I can understand jumpshots, but really you should be able to at least hit 65% of your FT's with a ton of work unless you have some sort of physical impediment.

Agent0
CTB MVP X1
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This isn't fair to Love, people always say this he plays "no defense" and it's just not true, he has his issues on defense, the main one outside of lack of length being that he plays hands down defense and doesn't contest, but he actually gets in position pretty well, and let's not ignore that securing the defensive rebound is an important part of defense.

Pekovic averaged 8.7 RPG in 30.8 mins, 10.1 rebs/36

Blake averaged 9.5 RPG in 35.8 mins which is the same per 36 obviously

Blake and Pekovic were similar level rebounders last season, and Love still rebounded extremely well playing next to Al Jefferson. He averaged 13.8 rebs/36 as a 2nd year player next to Al Jefferson's 10.3 rebs/36. The only year his rebounding was inflated from 13-14 RPG to 15 RPG was 10-11 when he was playing next to Darko who was not an impressive rebounder. Every other season he's grabbed them because he's good at it, he's a 12-14 RPG player.

SteveBaller
Clipper 6th Man
Posts: 238
votes: 5

Good points Agent0.

If the cap does go up as a result of the NBA tv deal, that won't be until the summer after next right? Or maybe that's the Clippers local tv contract I'm thinking of. If that's the case, CapsNClips is right that we'll be over the cap regardless when it comes time to resign DJ next summer. If we have an extra $10mil to play with, I imagine DJ would expect a fair bit more, largely negating the additional spending room.

I agree that we would definitely need a defensive C to compliment Hawes skillset if we lose DJ. I mentioned the idea of a s&t a few posts up where it would only be good for us if we could trade DJ plus Crawford/Barnes/Dudley to acquire an upgrade at the 3 as well as an MLE level defensive C. This sort of trade scenario would of course require a fair amount of good luck to ever materialize.

sz123456
Clipper All-Star
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I don't have a problem paying DJ what Wallace made on the Pistons, I have a problem paying him what Wallace made on the Bulls.

Junkyarddog
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Posts: 42
votes: 0

I don't know how the cap works, but I'd rather spend DJ's estimated 15-16 per year on two good players than 1 one dimensional center. I've been a clipper fan for many moons and I wish Dj really was the player people make him out to be, but he's not. If this is his contract year then I pretty much guarantee he will have his best year ever because $$$$$$ makes people real serious about their professions. It's just human nature. I also know the best predicament of future human behavior is past human behavior so In 7 years how much has dj come along really. He's just now doing what he could have done in year one if he just tried since year one. He's doesn't work on his game period. I bet if we all gathered 100 million dollars to give to Dj in one lump sum if he could hit 70% ft next season. I bet he'd at least get in the mid 60%. He'd be calling brick Barry up for those underhanded free throw lessons real quick. If we give Dj the max on potential I'm pretty sure his motivation to get better will go down. He knows as long as he's healthy he's gonna get huge money because of supply and demand. I just don't want the clips to get stuck with him like the nuggets have McGee, the bucks have sanders, the warriors PEE and BOGUS , pacers Roy hibert, etc.. Too many teams overpay for size and it ruins them financially.

Dj is 10 mil player IMO.

When your coach says just rebound and play defense don't worry about anything else.

Your usually the worst or dumbest player on the team. LoL.

I'd love for Dj to prove us doubters wrong, but he probably spent the day changing out the bong water while Blake and Chris shot a couple thousand jumpers.

Agent0
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 4446
votes: 44

I think the issue here is that like you said, you don't know how the cap works. It isn't DJ or $16M to spend, it is DJ or a player for about $6-7M at best if we also lose Jamal, Dudley and Barnes, and an a second player with the MLE. Not really so exciting.

SteveBaller
Clipper 6th Man
Posts: 238
votes: 5

Maybe not the best thread to ask this, but could you please break down our present cap situation AgentO?

I don't know all the ins and outs of the salary cap, but I do know elementary math. If we have to dump DJ($11m), Dudley($4m), Jamal($5m), and Barnes($3m) for a $6m player and an MLE level player ($5m) I need to go back to the second grade. Unless of course we're ALREADY around $12m over the cap which I really didn't think was the case.

Thanks in advance!

Junkyarddog
Clipper D-League Pickup
Posts: 42
votes: 0

The one thing I do know is there's always a way to get things done. I mean the cavs are about to have three max guys. While keeping a bunch of other players. I guess we just have to go over it. I'm hoping the new ownership is willing to overspend a bit, but not on Dj please.

Clippersfan86
CTB MVP Champion
Posts: 15370
votes: 91

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-bas ... in-2014-15

Good read.

Agent0
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 4446
votes: 44

Yea, I think that's where you got a little swayed. I believe currently the team is at $79M in salary, cap is $63M. If cap goes up to $65M for example, shedding $20M only gives the team $6M in space and then the exceptions.

ClipperKyle32
CTB MVP X1
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Posts: 3255
votes: 27
Whatever we do next season, it needs to be smart. I researched our contract number. Here's what I found. On The Books Next Season - $54,119,976 Chris Paul - $21,468,695 Blake Griffin - $18,862,876 JJ Redick - $7,085,000 Spencer Hawes....

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CP3Heliflopter
CTB MVP X2
Posts: 6013
votes: 10

8m a year for DJ is massive underpay. Barely above average players like Parsons and Hayward earn way more and quality centers are a rarity. 12m/yr at the minimum. Some team will offer him 14m+/yr for sure.

ClipperKyle32
CTB MVP X1
Posts: 3255
votes: 27

Tiago Splitter 8 PPG - 6 RPG - .5 BPG

14-15

$9,250,000

15-16

$8,500,000

16-17

$8,250,000

Some argue Splitter is better than DJ? Even on this thread some have said that. So I don't think 8 million range is too crazy for DJ.

MunoValente
Clipper Starter
Posts: 426
votes: 8

They are similar per minute but the big difference between the two is Jordan's huge advantage in durability and fitness. Jordan played nearly three times as many minutes last year for example. On top of that Jordan is also 4 years younger so he's likely to hold up better for the duration of his contract as well.

ClipperPostman
Clipper All-Star
Posts: 1374
votes: 18

Because guys don't get paid on opinions of fans who they "feel" is better.

A guy producing like DJ 10ppg - highest fg% - 14 RBG - 2.5 bpg and 3rd in DPOY award all at the age of 25 is FACT. Tiago will never produce those numbers even if he played 32 mpg.

DJ will get max contract offers point blank. This discussion should be whether w are going to match a max offer or let DJ walk.

tense2
CTB MVP X2
Posts: 9023
votes: 21

Exact $ numbers + options.

http://www.spotrac.com/nba/los-angeles-clippers/yearly/

tense2
CTB MVP X2
Posts: 9023
votes: 21

Here are the team cap figures for this year:

http://www.spotrac.com/cap-tracker/nba/

Here's more numbers for the near future:

http://data.shamsports.com/content/page ... ippers.jsp

Next year with the new TV deal the cap and tax levels will go up significantly I believe.

tense2
CTB MVP X2
Posts: 9023
votes: 21

If he decides to go the FA route he get an offer of 14+mil for sure IMO.

http://www.spotrac.com/rankings/nba/center/limit-25/

tense2
CTB MVP X2
Posts: 9023
votes: 21

I'll take DJ and so would these's guys.

http://www.boxscoregeeks.com/players/co ... eason=2013

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