Iverson for B. Davis?

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detroit_ed
Clipper D-League Pickup
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Hey, how would you guys like Allen Iverson on your team? I would love to see Camby and Davis, or Camby, Kaman and some other guys for Allen Iverson in a Pistons jersey.

What's going on over there? You guys got way too much talent to have that record. Is it the coaching? Are the players unhappy? No chemistry?

LAC_12
Clipper All-Star
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Coaching. period. with the few times the blame is put on chemistry, and injuries, and .... and.... and... Ive lost track of the excuses.

Well keep our chances without AI though.

detroit_ed
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Well what about Rasheed Wallace? I'm surprised that all of the championship contenders and near contenders aren't trying to get Camby on their team. If the Lakers, Cleveland, San Antonio, Boston, or Orlando were to add them to the team without losing too much, they should be favored to win it all.

Maybe a Rip Hamilton for Camby deal, hmm. Camby, Wallace, Prince, Iverson, and Stuckey could put us into contention.

clip
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new franchise record! 15 3´s

clip
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oops Shocked

wrong topic Smile

sz123456
Clipper All-Star
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Iverson for Davis? Hmmmmmmmmm, talk to me after we lose a game. I don't think clearly after we win, so right now I am very pro-Baron Davis.

journeyman
CTB MVP X1
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First of all, great screen name.

Iverson for Davis/Camby? That sort of makes sense. It would basically be a salary dump/rental on our side. It gives us a chance to get out from under Baron's contract. Iverson would bring the same problems, I suppose (selfish ballhog, and that's assuming he reports). But again, it would be strictly a rental, with a big chunk of salary relief for this summer. The Clippers would be better off holding on to Kaman though, as he fits better into their long-term plans than Camby.

detroit_ed
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journeyman wrote:
detroit_ed wrote:
Hey, how would you guys like Allen Iverson on your team? I would love to see Camby and Davis, or Camby, Kaman and some other guys for Allen Iverson in a Pistons jersey.

What's going on over there? You guys got way too much talent to have that record. Is it the coaching? Are the players unhappy? No chemistry?

First of all, great screen name.

Iverson for Davis/Camby? That sort of makes sense. It would basically be a salary dump/rental on our side. It gives us a chance to get out from under Baron's contract. Iverson would bring the same problems, I suppose (selfish ballhog, and that's assuming he reports). But again, it would be strictly a rental, with a big chunk of salary relief for this summer. The Clippers would be better off holding on to Kaman though, as he fits better into their long-term plans than Camby.

I think that was the appeal of having Iverson here. A chance to get into the 2010 free agency sweepstakes. But so many teams are thinking the same thing and dumping salary. So I don't think we'll get more than one of those top free agents.

ladodgermaniac
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Might not be that crazy of an idea. Dunleavy not that long ago was campaigning to bring A.I. to L.A. If Detroit would take back some bad contracts (Hart, Skinner, Ricky) and include a 1st round pick, I could see the trade happening. Clippers would save money this year (Sterling would jump for that), clear cap space for offseason (Artest, Marion, Boozer) and get another 1st rounder. Clips could also re-sign A.I. for much less in order to bring in a bigger Free Agent. This would put Clips 26 million under cap.

journeyman
CTB MVP X1
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Iverson's contract expires this upcoming summer '09. I'd love to have that cap space this summer, for the very factor you point out (other teams looking to dump talent for summer of 2010). Even if you can't lure a free agent, you could absorb contracts. Why not wait for Iverson to walk and let Dumars do his thing? And if he's got Baron in his sights, I hope he makes an offer (one that doens't include Wallace).

clipperAndrew
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Wrong, Look what Dunleavy did without Baron. He turned Gordon into a rookie sensation and had the team playing harder than every before. Baron is the problem. period. Until he plays like a team player (tonight he wasnt bad, had lots of assists) then we can win. Every team who has fired their coach hasnt done anything worth mentioning. It is not the coaching. It is baron, injuries, 13 new players (Kaman, Thornton from last year). Phil Jackson and Red Aurobach (SP) couldn't have done better...ok maybe 13 wins woohoo.

LAC_12
Clipper All-Star
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votes: 18

Please don't respond by saying "wrong", cause you for sure are not Nostradaumus, or have special powers... forgive me if you do.

Eric Gordon is a rookie sensation... he woulda found a way to blow up... Lord knows what Dumbleavy would've done had players not gotten injured. We can only measure what has happened in actuality, but fantasize what might have happened if we had a legit coach. Coaching is the problem when teams do not win, if a player is the reason - then its the coaching staffs responsibility to ameliorate it (and the GM, now who would that be)?

Dont bring great coaches into the question, above average coaches couldn't made drastic enough changes - playoffbound team, no. However we would not have landed at dead last in the NBA.

clipperAndrew
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so your saying "dumbleavy" is at fault for baron shooting like 35 percent from field this year and 29 from three point land chucking up threes all over the place? It is his fault Baron, Camby, Kaman, Randolph all wear out for lots of games? I just dont understand why the team plays extremely well when Baron went down and played with so much more heart...to me that sounds like something wrong with the players. Baron is known around the league as being a coachs nightmare. Everyone knows that. He is the leader of this team not Dunleavy. WE WENT TO THE SECOND ROUND OF THE PLAYOFFS WITH SAM CASSELL AND ELTON BRAND WITH DUNLEAVY AS COACH!!!!!!!! Imagine what we could do with the team we have, if only the players were not injured and everyone gets on the same page, it seems everyone on the team is...except Baron.

LAC_12
Clipper All-Star
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Then i guess its the coaches responsibility to take that virus outta the team. Im not riding Bdiddys cok, like some of you dumlevy cok riders - I mean that in the nicest way, no energy to articulate my mind. Matter of fact theres nothing to articulate to a Dun fan...

PS. I do blame dunleavy for Bdiddys performance, and the rest of the teams poor performance. If he was a legit coach hed have the respect of his team, he lsot that and now we just got people playing games to get payed cause their under contract. The guys a joke, hes turned this season into a joke, and yet again we are the laughing stock of the NBA. WE ARE A JOKE.

Credit to Cassell for our playoff success, for the most part - none of which belongs to Dun.

teamfiend
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Location: los angeles
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wow i never realized mds had such complete control over every single bad thing that has happened to this team since he has been here, as well as every single shred of positivity happening inspite of him. that is utterly amazing. why dont you go ahead and blame him for the bad economy while yer at it? and ive been looking for the guy who stole my car stereo last week, guess ill give coach a call....

that is alot of venom you have towards the guy lac12

NUMB3RFIFTY
Clipper All-Star
Posts: 1624

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I honestly think if someone was to open up this forum RIGHT now and read all the posts; he/she would think that most people want to see Baron AND Dunleavy gone.

That's simply not true.

The people who advocate both getting rid of Baron and Dunleavy basically want to see one or the other shipped out, not necessarily at the same time.

It's because if you follow the teams and it's woes, it really feels to most people like Dunleavy and Baron are tied to each other with a rope, and they're running in two different directions.

If Baron gets shipped, we'd play something that resembles organized defensive basketball.

If Dun gets shipped, we're going to be playing something that resembles Warriors Basketball... Where possessions come to dieeee

LAC_12
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it is... probably seems really hurtful to you dunleavy lovers as well. you guys know love and repect most things you say (especially you fiend) but this is one are where i see very very very little gray area. you cannot blame one player for a teams failure. you cannot blame injuries. you cannot blame chemistry. you cant go around for the rest of the history making excuses, then wed be the sorriest team in sports history (if we arent already) and we would never progress.

this is a profession. if A UNIT or multiple UNITS are not performing as a whole, management must make adjustments. team has failed and there are many excuses we can use, however, ultimately it falls into the hands of the damn man that coaches/manages and his staff! the team is not performing well, the people in charge of this teams performance is him and his crew... therefor, logically he is at fault. whether hes lucky or unlucky, i dont give a damn - in a profession he has failed, and as long as people can still support him he can still get paid to lead this team to failure.

i wish life was like that, getting paid to fail. heck even that would be difficult, its hard to fail as consistently as Dun does, job might be pretty difficult after all.

Miquel
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Iverson is done. We can get something much better for Davis if we finally decide to trade him.

clipper*joe
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LAC_12 wrote:
Then i guess its the coaches responsibility to take that virus outta the team. Im not riding Bdiddys cok, like some of you dumlevy cok riders - I mean that in the nicest way, no energy to articulate my mind. Matter of fact theres nothing to articulate to a Dun fan...

Actually, that statement ( in bold) is an incoherent sentence at best. It makes no sense. As far as the Dun fans go, you are confusing some that are trying to see this whole situation for what is is...a team problem with more than just the coach at fault. This "cok" thing you talk about is a bit much, don't you think? I mean, if you want to insult others with crap like that for standing by their opinions, then by your definition, you are waiting

for a new coach so you can ride his "cok", right?

Quote:
PS. I do blame dunleavy for Bdiddys performance, and the rest of the teams poor performance. If he was a legit coach hed have the respect of his team, he lsot that and now we just got people playing games to get payed cause their under contract. The guys a joke, hes turned this season into a joke, and yet again we are the laughing stock of the NBA. WE ARE A JOKE.

Wow, just wow! If that isn't riding someone's "cok", I really don't know what it is. For as many shots baron has taken in the worst opportune times in the games, you still want to blame someone else for baron's atrocious shooting% and shot selection? That is laughable.

Quote:

Credit to Cassell for our playoff success, for the most part - none of which belongs to Dun.

Yup, I credit Cassell for running Dunleavy's offense to perfection! I also blame Cassell for that 8 second count in the play-offs. Had he not been distracted by his ego and admired himself walking up the court lsmiling at the front row late in the game, maybe we would have won that game.

You also forget that Cassell was able to put everyone in their place when they got out of line. In other words, he was a true team leader that wasn't afraid to tell you when you were slacking. Baron? Don't make me laugh!

Plus, you also forget that Sam was a chucker too. The difference? Cassell made most of his ill-advised shots.

You must really hate Dun to the point that you rather give a player all the credit for that year's success instead of the coach that brought him in knowing he would stay true to Dun's philosophy.

So if cassell was that great, why can't Baron take control of the team and do what an older broken down player did several years ago?

You can't have it both way here. If Dun sucked from the start and let Cassell run this team, why wouldn't Baron be smart enough to do what Cassell did...if that is how it really went down?

Oh, that's right, Cassell played with heart, made his shots and followed orders. Baron? Don't get me started...

clipperAndrew
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Look LAC_12...there is no doubt you are frustrated with this season as am I and every other Clipper fan. If you are a clipper fan and you arent frustrated then you must be delusional. However there have been many bright spots. Like Eric Gordon, Al Thornton, bringing in Camby and Randolph and yes the singing of Baron Davis and yes the injuries. The injuries have made guys play more minutes and learn a decent system. Mardy Collins and Fred Jones are great pick ups for us...our bench is mush stronger as of late. This team WHEN HEALTHY has the chance to be very very good. You cannot blame management for fluke injuries. I was at the game when Baron landed straight on his tailbone and it got bruised, no way was he lying about that injury he fell like 5 feet straight down on it and the entire crowd heard the sound it made, we all saw Camby go down with the ankle and Randolph having that cheap foul on him. How can you blame management. How can you blame Baron for not being a leader. Everyone on this team looks up to Camby, he is our leader and rightfully so. But he is only our leader for a little, Baron needs to take the reign. He needs to start yelling at guys if they mess up, congratulate when do good.

Every single timeout or the ball was stopped you would see Sam Cassell going over to someone, make them stop right infront of him as Sam would show them "look if he going there, you need to screen there" or "how are you suppose to get in the lane if you dont side step?" Of course I never really knew what he was saying but you can tell by the way he was shouting at Kaman or someone else that he was telling them what he wanted. He was a true Leader. Baron can be!...but has not shown it this year.

I will however give you this if this team when healthy fails again like it has this year I would all for having a new coach.

PS. Are you blaming Phil Jackson for Andrew Bynums knee?

LAC_12
Clipper All-Star
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I could care less for Davis.. he stays he leaves... However i care for Dunleavy. He needs to leave. If Baron is the problem then Dunleavy is not doing his job to fix the situation... (change his style of coaching, incorporate some more transition basketball, run new plays since the "old ones" arent, or trade him away)...

So lets not confuse my motives... I like this team - I just think our coach is inadequate. My position we obviously have people who feel otherwise. For those who want to blame Bdiddy, then you are, by default, blaming dunleavy - yet youre too blinded ot notice it. its hypocritical.

Anyways... here another (side point brought upon by andrew). No Im not blaming Phil Jackson for Bynums knee (we have kobe for that Very Happy). However we do see how Phil reacts to injuries... he goes into Boston and defeats the defending champs shorthanded (second time this season). WHEN YOU WIN EXCUSES ARE NOT NEEDED, ITS ONLY WHEN YOU LOOSE.

sz123456
Clipper All-Star
Posts: 2354
votes: 13

I don't agree with all of your Dunleavy bashing, though some of it is deserved for sure. But I STRONGLY agree with not having excuses. Too many teams do that, us included. Too many games this season you could see that our players were trying hard but were thinking all the way through "welllllll, zach and baron are out, so we shouldn't really even win this one". Excuses bother me

LAC_12
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votes: 18

x2

Excuses piss me off. Especially when i know they are getting paid millions...

dunc182
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what pisses me off is that if a motivational coach like doc rivers got in there, he could transform this team. the coach is one of the most important aspects, and if we keep baron, we need to have a coach who can give him a good strong kick up the backside, so he can pass it on to his team.

CLIPPER$ZONE
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I want Livingston back lol He had so much potential.....

LAsonlyteam
Clipper 6th Man
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Location: Los Angeles
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^^ forget about him.. potential my ass w/ that guy hes done... d-leauge for him.. backstabbed us... We treated him very well..as well as turning down deals including him left and right for what??

toohipcliptoslip
CTB MVP X1
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At least Dunleavy cares and wants to win. BD doesn't. How can one man ruin a season single handedly? Here's how

You chuck a 3 and the other team gets the long rebound, fast break and scores. You lose a possession. Instead of being up 2 (easy shot) you're down 2. That's how you lose games. If you were a team mate how would you feel if your Capt is tanking the team? Blown layups. He's probably 50% on them. Dunleavy tells him to stop chucking and he does it anyway. He's at his best when he crashes the boards and we have shooters now and good post players. When you shoot a crappy shot instead of going strong for a high% shot you go from 50% to 32% .The other team gets the board. Instead of up 2 down 2. You laugh when your team gets blown out instead of getting pissed. That's how you destroy a team all by your lonesome.

toohipcliptoslip
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ps If you had a child who acted like this you'd sit him in a corner until he behaved. Why take this from a grown man? . Iverson is a volume shooter which we don't need

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